So I started watching TPM today as I'm going to watch all 8 through the week. One question I have is why Padme didn't go back to Tatooine for Shmi? Surely she could have offered Watto to whatever he wanted??
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Why didn't Padme go back for Shmi
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Yes this is seriously messed up. Adds to my theory Palme didn’t really give a sht about creepy young anakine, makes much more sense that she would be looking more toward Obiwan, who then disappeared for the next 10 years. Once the Jedi left she basically forgot about the slave mom who’s kid literally saved her planet.
but this is the same planet that elected a “12” year old Queen so it might be best to dwell on the back room politics of the sht whole planet
but this is the same planet that elected a “12” year old Queen so it might be best to dwell on the back room politics of the sht whole planet
^^^ The “elected” Queen narrative is so needlessly clunky. Why not just have her as the reluctant Monarch who comes into her own…??? (And apparently, these dumb people just keep "electing" teen girls to rule over them… Dumb and creepy LOL)
In fairness of TPM being the first act of a 3-part trilogy, it’s not the responsibility of TPM’s narrative to resolve Shmi's dilemma It’s a problem that should have been easily resolved in AOTC: A resolution that doesn’t need to be shown— just a brief exposition from Obi-Wan telling Anakin his mother is safe now that she's no longer a slave, when Anakin tells Obi-Wan of his premonition/nightmares of his mother’s impending doom. That’s all it takes.
In fairness of TPM being the first act of a 3-part trilogy, it’s not the responsibility of TPM’s narrative to resolve Shmi's dilemma It’s a problem that should have been easily resolved in AOTC: A resolution that doesn’t need to be shown— just a brief exposition from Obi-Wan telling Anakin his mother is safe now that she's no longer a slave, when Anakin tells Obi-Wan of his premonition/nightmares of his mother’s impending doom. That’s all it takes.
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I'm guessing GL thought it was necessary in order for the 1977 movie to line up with the prequels, re: "uncle" owen.
somehow or another, anakin needed to have a brother left behind on tattooine.
since anakin had no brother in TPM, then that meant Shmi had to stay behind, at least until her story could be written to include a "brother" of some kind.
ie: if Shmi had been freed in TPM, then there's no reason for her to remain on tattooine -- she would follow anakin to coruscant.
and then how do we explain "Uncle" Owen, living the quiet life, as a quiet farmer on tattooine?
--> Shmi was tied-to-tattooine by the existence of anakins's brother in the 1977 movie. she couldn't leave.
somehow or another, anakin needed to have a brother left behind on tattooine.
since anakin had no brother in TPM, then that meant Shmi had to stay behind, at least until her story could be written to include a "brother" of some kind.
ie: if Shmi had been freed in TPM, then there's no reason for her to remain on tattooine -- she would follow anakin to coruscant.
and then how do we explain "Uncle" Owen, living the quiet life, as a quiet farmer on tattooine?
--> Shmi was tied-to-tattooine by the existence of anakins's brother in the 1977 movie. she couldn't leave.
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This is a good question!
From a story standpoint, it always bothered me the way Anakin left her in TPM and that in 10 years, with as rebellious as he was never found time to hop on a ship and go rescue her. It would have been easy Watto was a push over. Don't Jedi get time off or would he not have some time away from Obi-Wan to run off? Even if he didn't he could have always walked away from the Jedi Order for a time. I mean this was his Mom the only person there for him at all the first 10 years of his life. I really think the soon to be Darth Vader would have found a way sometime between 10 and 18 to do this before he finally went in AOTC?
Watto was not oppressive.
Shmi lived in a decent house and she worked for him, so it's really no different from anyone else that works for a company beyond the fact that she CAN'T leave... which for many is still rather accurate. I'm not saying Anakin SHOULD have left her there, but as a Jedi Padawan he didn't have the means to take care of her. He could have asked for someone to help like Padme, but he didn't have any real contact with her during that 10 year gap. I imagine it was like he was off at college. He imagined one day to be able to return, but he needed to become a full Jedi Knight and then he could do what he wanted. Unfortunately he was too late.
I always liked the idea that it wasn't even really the Tuskens that took Shmi. Palpatine needed Anakin to turn to the dark, so I like to think that he had a hand in Shmi being abducted and tortured in order for Anakin to fulfill his destiny.
Shmi lived in a decent house and she worked for him, so it's really no different from anyone else that works for a company beyond the fact that she CAN'T leave... which for many is still rather accurate. I'm not saying Anakin SHOULD have left her there, but as a Jedi Padawan he didn't have the means to take care of her. He could have asked for someone to help like Padme, but he didn't have any real contact with her during that 10 year gap. I imagine it was like he was off at college. He imagined one day to be able to return, but he needed to become a full Jedi Knight and then he could do what he wanted. Unfortunately he was too late.
I always liked the idea that it wasn't even really the Tuskens that took Shmi. Palpatine needed Anakin to turn to the dark, so I like to think that he had a hand in Shmi being abducted and tortured in order for Anakin to fulfill his destiny.
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My guess is the Council was wary of Anakin's attachment to his mother. They were already reluctant to train him back in TPM. After being guilt-tripped into honouring Qui-Gon's dying wish, they decide to keep a close eye on him and never give Obi-Wan assignments to Tatooine. As a Padawan, Anakin's never allowed to undertake missions on his own and I bet a Jedi doesn't get days off. They're rather monk-like. It's a way of life, a calling, not a job.
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its a missed opportunity for parallel storytelling. in ROTS anakin had a "Secret" marriage with padme. he visited her in her apartment on the sly. nobody was supposed to know about it. not even the Jedi Order.
--> it would have been interesting to see the same thing in AOTC with Shmi. perhaps watto would not sell Shmi at ANY price, so padme could have 'stolen' Shmi away from watto, and set her up in an apartment on coruscant. anakin would visit her in secret, nobody is supposed to know about it, not even the Jedi Order. that kind of thing.
Shmi would die, of course. maybe BECAUSE of this secret relationship with a Jedi -- her association to anakin would put her in danger. losing his mother in this way would create a parallel to his fear of losing padme. maybe the Hutts learn of her whereabouts and send Jango Fett to kill her (parallel to Jango being sent to kill Padme, later in the movie)
(ie : instead of just "jedi dreams" being the only bit of parallel storytelling between the 2 scenarios -- "I Won't Lose You Like I Lost My Mother" -- he dreamt about his mother dying and she died; now he's dreaming about padme dying so he's afraid of padme dying -- the only connecting tissue here is "anakin has nightmares").
(it would be more interesting if Shmi was anakin''s "Secret Relationship" in AOTC, in the SAME way that padme was his "Secret Relationship" in ROTS). that kind of thing.
--> it would have been interesting to see the same thing in AOTC with Shmi. perhaps watto would not sell Shmi at ANY price, so padme could have 'stolen' Shmi away from watto, and set her up in an apartment on coruscant. anakin would visit her in secret, nobody is supposed to know about it, not even the Jedi Order. that kind of thing.
Shmi would die, of course. maybe BECAUSE of this secret relationship with a Jedi -- her association to anakin would put her in danger. losing his mother in this way would create a parallel to his fear of losing padme. maybe the Hutts learn of her whereabouts and send Jango Fett to kill her (parallel to Jango being sent to kill Padme, later in the movie)
(ie : instead of just "jedi dreams" being the only bit of parallel storytelling between the 2 scenarios -- "I Won't Lose You Like I Lost My Mother" -- he dreamt about his mother dying and she died; now he's dreaming about padme dying so he's afraid of padme dying -- the only connecting tissue here is "anakin has nightmares").
(it would be more interesting if Shmi was anakin''s "Secret Relationship" in AOTC, in the SAME way that padme was his "Secret Relationship" in ROTS). that kind of thing.
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Or maybe Anakin could have gone back to get his mum and cut Watto to pieces instead of some random sand people.
Isn't it the Jedi way that once a baby is identified as being Foce sensitive, and the parents allow it, they are taken from their family and raised in the Jedi order. They don't have any more contact with their family at that point. Being taken away at such a young age it's not really a problem since the child has no connection to their parents. Anakin was a unique case since he was so old when he started to train. But, perhaps they were just following their normal rules regarding such things.
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I always thought it would have worked much better if Anakin had disobeyed orders or walked away from Jedi to save his Mom. Then, like Luke in ESB not fully trained went anyway with the Jedi saying no, no not the right thing to do.
He goes, and not only does he fail to save her, but he accidentally kills her while trying to liberate her. He really messes up and must live with that guilt. Then returns to the Jedi begging for forgiveness and understanding. The Jedi will hear none of it. They chastise him and are unforgiving. Obi-Wan included, offering him no compassion only saying I told you so.
Now he has an endless supply of hate for himself and the sanctimonious Jedi. No need for any other sources. Only Padme and Palpatine offer him comfort and support. They tell him he did the right thing by following his heart and it was the Jedi that were wrong.
You raise a good point about Padme thou.
He goes, and not only does he fail to save her, but he accidentally kills her while trying to liberate her. He really messes up and must live with that guilt. Then returns to the Jedi begging for forgiveness and understanding. The Jedi will hear none of it. They chastise him and are unforgiving. Obi-Wan included, offering him no compassion only saying I told you so.
Now he has an endless supply of hate for himself and the sanctimonious Jedi. No need for any other sources. Only Padme and Palpatine offer him comfort and support. They tell him he did the right thing by following his heart and it was the Jedi that were wrong.
You raise a good point about Padme thou.
She did, well, she sent someone to Tatooine in any case. Read Queen's Shadow, it came out Spring 2019.
Given the seedy politics of Naboo, I kind of figured that maybe no one wanted to tell the story of a 8 year old who stole a fighter jet. (cough) Iron Eagle style (cough) Destroyed the enemy base while the regular air force stood bye while millions of people were dying.
Ani goes off with his child abductors to join the cult, No one will hear from him until he is "compliant"
Naboo rewrites its own history.
Let the slave girl be forgotten. (especially if Palps had something to do with her "fatherless" child.)
See the film is much more dark than you remember.
Ani goes off with his child abductors to join the cult, No one will hear from him until he is "compliant"
Naboo rewrites its own history.
Let the slave girl be forgotten. (especially if Palps had something to do with her "fatherless" child.)
See the film is much more dark than you remember.
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One thing I had often imagined, was Padme trying to bring up extending the Republic’a anti-slavery laws to the Outer Rim territories, in hopes that such a move might be able to free Shmi.
However, I could imagine the Senate claiming such a notion was a waste of time, and her attempts were voted down in favor of more, “lucrative” proposals.
However, I could imagine the Senate claiming such a notion was a waste of time, and her attempts were voted down in favor of more, “lucrative” proposals.
Never saw this post before. You know, that's an interesting question. I've NEVER thought of this. I mean regardless of what the Senate would say, this is a woman who helped lead a rebellion to free her peoples from the Trade Federation. I'm pretty sure, if she really wanted to do something she felt was just...she would. And who would REALLY CARE on the legalities in the senate if she went back to Tatooine and took Shmi from Watto (a slave owner from the outer rim) by force? But there are a few issues here...
1. That isn't really in her character to use force unless UTTERLY forced TO. And while Shmi was a slave, something she strongly disagreed with, Shmi wasn't in danger in TPM. I can't see her going in, blasters drawn on Watto. She'd go the legal route. Thus like the above post said, well attempting that in the senate is probably fruitless. They don't care about little dust ***** like Tatooine. So she likely couldn't do it legally, she's HAVE to go rogue and go it herself by force or at the least send some of her guard to to it for her. But a personality like her, well she ain't gonna be thinking of Shmi alone either. She's going to think of all the slaves...which will snowball into slaves on OTHER planets too. What is she gonna do, liberate every planet that has slaves from slavery? Now that WILL get the senates attention. That could cause her issues. That's how separatism starts.
2. Realistically, by the time of AOTC, she knew Anakin was a Jedi. She knew the Jedi took folks from their parents, attachment is forbidden. And neither had any real idea she was NOW in danger from the sandpeople until Anakin's premonition. Cold as it sounds, both probably just thought...such is our lives now and hers as well. What cha gonna do?
1. That isn't really in her character to use force unless UTTERLY forced TO. And while Shmi was a slave, something she strongly disagreed with, Shmi wasn't in danger in TPM. I can't see her going in, blasters drawn on Watto. She'd go the legal route. Thus like the above post said, well attempting that in the senate is probably fruitless. They don't care about little dust ***** like Tatooine. So she likely couldn't do it legally, she's HAVE to go rogue and go it herself by force or at the least send some of her guard to to it for her. But a personality like her, well she ain't gonna be thinking of Shmi alone either. She's going to think of all the slaves...which will snowball into slaves on OTHER planets too. What is she gonna do, liberate every planet that has slaves from slavery? Now that WILL get the senates attention. That could cause her issues. That's how separatism starts.
2. Realistically, by the time of AOTC, she knew Anakin was a Jedi. She knew the Jedi took folks from their parents, attachment is forbidden. And neither had any real idea she was NOW in danger from the sandpeople until Anakin's premonition. Cold as it sounds, both probably just thought...such is our lives now and hers as well. What cha gonna do?
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I do feel she wouldn’t totally forget Shmi, given how she knew how much Anakin cared for his Mother, but going from a Queen to a Senator, suddenly she has to take into account a whole bunch of other things in relation to the Republic.
I do know in the book “Queen’s Shadow,” there was a bit where she sent 1-2 of her handmaidens to Tattooine to look for Shmi, but it really felt very “meh” in how the book attempted to tell the concept.
I do know in the book “Queen’s Shadow,” there was a bit where she sent 1-2 of her handmaidens to Tattooine to look for Shmi, but it really felt very “meh” in how the book attempted to tell the concept.
Yes agreed, for a Senator it's a much more delicate subject than I think a lot think. See one thing folks need to keep in mind. This isn't real life, it's not one planet or country or etc. This is a GALAXY riddled with TONS of planets. It's not as simple as hey, let's play Lincoln and free the slaves...likely war will break out like it did in real life, but you get my point. It's MUCH more complex when you throw in lord only knows how many planets and cultures, some not sworn to the Republic either, some even likely not fully explored. Plus we also must keep in mind, she barely knew Anakin in TPM. Sure he made an impression, but they hadn't seen each other for how long by the time of AOTC? By the time she was done with Queenship and became a senator, would she REALLY even be thinking THAT OFTEN of Anakin anymore? And for that matter, then his mother? She's thinking of her new career as a senator...and launching what would snowball into a full scale anti-slavery on outer rim worlds, something that LIKELY would result in wars across many planets, isn't exactly how you get elected a senator when it'll face such initial resistance. Again, it takes a much slower, long game, subtle and delicate approach. So by the time she DID help Anakin get Shmi, well unfortunately...it was too late. Something they didn't truly know until, well, it happened.
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What I want to know is why Shmi never made a space call to Anakin once Cliegg Lars bought her from Watto and freed her. At the very least she could have let him know she moved to a new place. It's just common curtesy. 
I would tell my child if I moved to a new house. I wouldn't leave it up to them to try to track me down. One can only conclude that Shmi never really liked Anakin and didn't want to be found. Maybe she thought he was a super annoying kid and would most likely grow up to be a maladjusted jerk. I mother just knows.
I would tell my child if I moved to a new house. I wouldn't leave it up to them to try to track me down. One can only conclude that Shmi never really liked Anakin and didn't want to be found. Maybe she thought he was a super annoying kid and would most likely grow up to be a maladjusted jerk. I mother just knows.
Padme was "elected" "Queen" at age 12/13? B!tch obviously had some connections & skeletons in the closet.
Watching the movie with older eyes. She obviously treated Ani like a child & realistically was more into Obiwan.
Obi: Hello There! waves hands "I was the greatest lover of your life but don't call me."
10 years later she is very excited to see Obi, Then creepy Ani walks in. He tries all movie to wave his hand, as her sudden interest towards the end of the film does feel more like a mind trick.
His final turn to the dark side, makes more sense & is more organic with this knowledge.
I can get much darker into this theory.
Watching the movie with older eyes. She obviously treated Ani like a child & realistically was more into Obiwan.
Obi: Hello There! waves hands "I was the greatest lover of your life but don't call me."
10 years later she is very excited to see Obi, Then creepy Ani walks in. He tries all movie to wave his hand, as her sudden interest towards the end of the film does feel more like a mind trick.
His final turn to the dark side, makes more sense & is more organic with this knowledge.
I can get much darker into this theory.
What I want to know is why Shmi never made a space call to Anakin once Cliegg Lars bought her from Watto and freed her. At the very least she could have let him know she moved to a new place. It's just common curtesy.
That's an interesting question and opens a new one for me: are Jedi ALLOWED to still SPEAK to their parents? I mean, maybe?
I don't think she disliked him, but for your hypothetical...if she did I don't think it would be for those reasons. ALL kids are kind of irritating as a certain age. Hah! Well...IMO. If she disliked him, I'd think it would be this really deeply reseeded guilt feeling of resentment for how...well...she never ASKED to be pregnant. It wasn't even an accidental pregnancy, it was immaculate conception.
Padme was "elected" "Queen" at age 12/13? B!tch obviously had some connections & skeletons in the closet.
Watching the movie with older eyes. She obviously treated Ani like a child & realistically was more into Obiwan.
Obi: Hello There! waves hands "I was the greatest lover of your life but don't call me."
10 years later she is very excited to see Obi, Then creepy Ani walks in. He tries all movie to wave his hand, as her sudden interest towards the end of the film does feel more like a mind trick.
His final turn to the dark side, makes more sense & is more organic with this knowledge.
I can get much darker into this theory.
I don't think that's TOO dark because, I've got to be honest, my man: Back in the day I'd OFTEN wondered if perhaps Anakin's turn by the time of EP3 would be due to either Obi-Wan HAVING a flirtation with Padme and Anakin grows increasingly suspicious or jealous - OR - Anakin and Padme are discovered and he's excommunicated from the Jedi and resentful. I really think those reasons would have been better and more natural than what we got in the final film.
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it was rape.
(there was no consent -- she had no knowledge of what had even happened to her -- it's pretty hard to give "consent" when you don't even know its happening... and then you just wake up pregnant(!?)... there's a word for that).*
* google:"roofie"
(just saying).
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EXACTLY! Dark as that is, it's basically what seems to have happened even in canon just via powers and not on a physical way.
I'm sure it was explained off screen like all the other unimportant characters. And part of it is likely the fact a Senator is far too busy to care about one individual outside the Republic's jurisdiction not to mention that Qui-Gon likely already explained to Shmi the Jedi rules for taking on the child and that she's never to contact him again?
Or maybe she truly was relived that a burden was lifted by them taking Anakin, if she truly felt he pregnancy was "forced" upon her. Though she did keep said child so there's that, and maybe she did wind up caring for him. A bond between mother and child transcends all, regardless of it being possible rape?
If she were on Earth Anakin would have been placed in an orphanage or foster care until eventually adopted.
Or maybe she truly was relived that a burden was lifted by them taking Anakin, if she truly felt he pregnancy was "forced" upon her. Though she did keep said child so there's that, and maybe she did wind up caring for him. A bond between mother and child transcends all, regardless of it being possible rape?
If she were on Earth Anakin would have been placed in an orphanage or foster care until eventually adopted.
Qui-Gon was planning that child kidnapping the moment he met Ani, he didn’t explain **** to anyone. Classic case of grooming. The fact that this stuff was not only allowed in the old republic but literally systemized just shows maybe the Empire wasn’t such a bad idea.
Obi & Ani are survivors! Yoda knew! That’s why Yoda put his own kid into hiding!
Obi & Ani are survivors! Yoda knew! That’s why Yoda put his own kid into hiding!
I seem to remember that in ‘Dark Heart of the Sith’ part 3, Padme send Captain Tonra & Sabe back Tatooine to free Shmi, but only after her rule of Naboo had come to an end & she became a Senator that roughly 8 years after the events of TPM.
In the Old EU didn’t Qui-Gon Jinn give Shmi something of value to help buy her freedom & told her that she would know who she would be able to trust with it that ended up being Cliegg Lars. Also wasn’t something about Qui-Gon sending someone by the name of Lars to Tatooine to free Shmi from slavery & Lars took his son, Owen with him. The reason why Qui-Gon picked him was because there was a collection him & Obi-Wan, maybe he was Obi-Wan’s father. Now I don’t where I got this from, it could be article in magazine or a book or a comic or a friend’s crackpot theory because like me, he had read the novelisation ROTJ. I know the friend in question, I’m thinking about told me something about Star Trek & I have never been able to find out if true or not.
In the Old EU didn’t Qui-Gon Jinn give Shmi something of value to help buy her freedom & told her that she would know who she would be able to trust with it that ended up being Cliegg Lars. Also wasn’t something about Qui-Gon sending someone by the name of Lars to Tatooine to free Shmi from slavery & Lars took his son, Owen with him. The reason why Qui-Gon picked him was because there was a collection him & Obi-Wan, maybe he was Obi-Wan’s father. Now I don’t where I got this from, it could be article in magazine or a book or a comic or a friend’s crackpot theory because like me, he had read the novelisation ROTJ. I know the friend in question, I’m thinking about told me something about Star Trek & I have never been able to find out if true or not.
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I was thinking of her final words to him in Ep I: “Now, be brave, and don’t look back...don’t look back.”
I think she felt they probably wouldn’t see each other again, and she was entrusting Qui-Gon to take him away to a life she felt he could thrive in, a bit like Charles Kane in “Citizen Kane.” Kane also had a “mother issue” that stunted him psychologically for much of his life, and he was never able to really shake that either.
In the Taschen book on the prequels, Lucas describes the Jedi as “Warrior Monks,” and the general thought on monestaries is you shun earthly pleasures and contacts, to focus on what the group feels are the more important, “enlightened” things.
There has been the talk that Anakin’s connection to his mother was something that caused the council issues, which was why usually children were taken at a younger age before they could develop strong parental attachments.
I just assumed that the answer has something to do with the fact that it wasn't a very good or well thought out movie.
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