"Rogue One" - December 16, 2016

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My dime store theory.....

Rey and Kylo are twins, but no one knows. Han was not there for the birth and Leia had her taken away to protect her, after feeling a strong force connection.
That partially explains Leia's feelings when she hugged her, when they met in TFA.
Ben is older than Rey, but I think they are brother and sister. Ben snuck Rey out of the academy, and dumped her on Jakku, before he killed everyone so he wouldn't have to kill his sister. Leia and Han think their daughter is dead and never look for her, but Han and Leia still had a soft spot for Rey because she reminds them of the daughter they lost. Ben overreacts to the mention of a girl on Jakku, he knew about Rey. Luke had the "oh crap!" face when he realized Rey was not dead.

First drafts of TFA had Rey's name as Kira (Kylo), Rey (Ren)
 
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Ben is older than Rey, but I think they are brother and sister. Ben snuck Rey out of the academy, and dumped her on Jakku, before he killed everyone so he wouldn't have to kill his sister. Leia and Han think their daughter is dead and never look for her, but Han and Leia still had a soft spot for Rey because she reminds them of the daughter they lost. Ben overreacts to the mention of a girl on Jakku, he knew about Rey. Luke had the "oh crap!" face when he realized Rey was not dead.

First drafts of TFA had Rey's name as Kira (Kylo), Rey (Ren)
Her name might still be Kira, I think she took the name Rey from that X-wing helmet she wears, which has the name Rae on the side.
 
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But Kylo is ''Ben", so the Kira/Kylo thing only works if they are both Sith. Right? Her real name should still be something else.
Kira was probably the name she would have used, had their roles been reversed. I wouldn't be surprised if her name is related to a previous SW character. While I am not exactly sure how Kylo wound up being named Ben, or what truly went on there. But if it was due to certain reasons, then surely Rey's name will be linked to that family somehow.
Possibly reuse Shmi? Or even someone from Naberrie family line?
 
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First of all...

Tarkin didn't destroy the Scarif base to get rid of Data, he did it to get rid of that troublesome gnat. Buzzing around thinking he was gonna control the Death Star.

Second, who in their right mind thought Kennric was going to be a bad*****? He's a military politician, that's it.

And why are people saying that "choking on your ambitions" isn't a Vader line. It's just as sarcastic as accepting an apology from the dude you just choked to death.


A little off topic but not considering someone wants to take their Krennic figure back. Who had just as cool an outfit, more screen time and more dialog than Boba Fett? Captain Phasma.
 
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First of all...

Tarkin didn't destroy the Scarif base to get rid of Data, he did it to get rid of that troublesome gnat. Buzzing around thinking he was gonna control the Death Star.

Second, who in their right mind thought Kennric was going to be a bad*****? He's a military politician, that's it.

And why are people saying that "choking on your ambitions" isn't a Vader line. It's just as sarcastic as accepting an apology from the dude you just choked to death.


A little off topic but not considering someone wants to take their Krennic figure back. Who had just as cool an outfit, more screen time and more dialog than Boba Fett? Captain Phasma.
Krennic is a convenient kill but the blast goes straight through the satellite dish.

As for Vader's line, there's a difference between having a sarcastic line and using a pun (puns are corny as hell). It's also Vader's only scene of dialogue and his last line of the movie--It probably wouldn't really stand out if there were multiple scenes of dialogue.
 
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But Kylo is ''Ben", so the Kira/Kylo thing only works if they are both Sith. Right? Her real name should still be something else.
Kira was probably the name she would have used, had their roles been reversed. I wouldn't be surprised if her name is related to a previous SW character. While I am not exactly sure how Kylo wound up being named Ben, or what truly went on there. But if it was due to certain reasons, then surely Rey's name will be linked to that family somehow.
Possibly reuse Shmi? Or even someone from Naberrie family line?
Maybe she will turn to the dark side. Here is a possible idea that I have been chewing on. Luke's blue saber is heavily imbued with the dark side, its the saber that Anakin held when he turned to the dark side, murdered a bunch of jedi, and killed the trade federation leaders in cold blood. It was also the saber Luke was holding when he failed his test in the dark side cave. It's further imbued with Luke's despair and pain at finding out Vader was his father, and then getting his hand chopped off. When Rey wields this saber for the first time, she overcomes Kylo in a rage and cuts him down with a hateful look on her face. This saber and its dark influence along with the darkness in Luke himself will ultimately turn Rey fully to the dark side.

Now the other side of the coin. The Vader helmet that Kylo worships is actually imbued with the light. Its the helmet Vader is wearing when he is reunited with his son, begins having doubts about serving the dark side, and is ultimately redeemed to the light after sacrificing himself to destroy the master of the Sith. This helmet is why Kylo keeps being drawn to the light, the very thing he is attempting to draw darkness from is actually pulling him away from it. This means that eventually Kylo will renounce the darkness, embrace the light, and destroy Rey and her master Luke.

The final blow, Luke is using the Snoke hologram as a disguise and he is actually the dark lord. He gave in to his anger when he fought Vader that last time and once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny. Years of grappling with causing the death of his own father finally consumed him and he fell to darkness. Watching the Republic that he fought so hard to help build turn into a cesspool of bureaucracy and corruption drove him to try and re-create the Empire. He actually started the jedi academy as a way to lure the remaining people with Force abilities into one place so he could destroy them while pretending to be an alien named Snoke and using Kylo as his pawn.

How about that for a twist?
 
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While interesting, not my cup of tea. I'm just not into the Skywalker Darkside curse, that was prevalent throughout the EU. And I sure don't want to see it consume the Canon movies. If that happens, check please!
 
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While interesting, not my cup of tea. I'm just not into the Skywalker Darkside curse, that was prevalent throughout the EU. And I sure don't want to see it consume the Canon movies. If that happens, check please!
I remember hating Dark Empire when it came out for that very reason.
 
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But Kylo is ''Ben", so the Kira/Kylo thing only works if they are both Sith. Right? Her real name should still be something else.
Kira was probably the name she would have used, had their roles been reversed. I wouldn't be surprised if her name is related to a previous SW character. While I am not exactly sure how Kylo wound up being named Ben, or what truly went on there. But if it was due to certain reasons, then surely Rey's name will be linked to that family somehow.
Possibly reuse Shmi? Or even someone from Naberrie family line?

Kasdan said the art of naming characters comes from rolling them around on your tongue and chewing on them until they sound catchy. that's it.

Ben --> Ren. because the letter "R" looks like a "B" (with a little piece missing on the bottom).

Ren --> Rey. because "N" = negative , and "Y" = positive. (y/n = yes/no = light/dark).

https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/l/lawrenceka395941.html

^^ (dude's "not too smart") :\
 
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While interesting, not my cup of tea. I'm just not into the Skywalker Darkside curse, that was prevalent throughout the [Old EU]. And I sure don't want to see it consume the [New EU]. If that happens, check please!
fixed. :p



-===-


and, speaking of "New Canon" (or whatever) ... now that R1 is out .. I was wondering .. what is the "Canon" color of Saw's eyes? (in TCW? in the movies?) hmmm... :confused:

(so much for the "story group" -- these "canon accountants" aren't really good for much.. :( *sigh* :( ..they can't account for the simplest detail). :(

--> this New EU is off to a running start :p LOL

(much like the LAST one *sigh*)
 
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fixed. :p



-===-


and, speaking of "New Canon" (or whatever) ... now that R1 is out .. I was wondering .. what is the "Canon" color of Saw's eyes? (in TCW? in the movies?) hmmm... :confused:

(so much for the "story group" -- these "canon accountants" aren't really good for much.. :( *sigh* :( ..they can't account for the simplest detail). :(

--> this New EU is off to a running start :p LOL

(much like the LAST one *sigh*)
From what I can tell, they're fully aware of it. In the Rebels S3 pt. 2 marketing he has green eyes. It seems like his eye color changing is a deliberate choice.
 
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I was assuming all the blue lobsters were boiled and turned red :p
Ackbar's group in ROTJ are the ones that survived the boiling.......... ok stupid comedy over.
 
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I don't know how heavily involved the Death Star is in the Tarkin novel, but does that book fit in with the details of the station's history and construction we see in Rogue One?

I bought it when it was released (but haven't got around to reading it) and although it is classed as canon it was obviously written before the EU was ended - unless the decision had been made a long time prior to the announcement - so I imagined there might be some discrepancies as time goes on.

I know Luceno also wrote the Catalyst novel. Was he chosen to help iron out any inconsistencies (if there was any) between Tarkin and Rogue One?

As I on the topic, does the Dark Lords of the Sith novel also fit in with the new canon - for example, in Season Two of Rebels it is established that Darth Vader is previously unheard of by the Ghost crew and Ashoka because he he only leaves Mustafar when he has to deal with problems personally and there is generally no one left to talk about afterwards.
 
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I don't know how heavily involved the Death Star is in the Tarkin novel, but does that book fit in with the details of the station's history and construction we see in Rogue One?
The Tarkin novel spends exactly one page on the Death Star, and it's the last page. On that page, the station is still unfinished (no dish, no hyperdrive) and he gives the order to fly out of the Geonosian orbit using the sub-light engines. That's about it.

If I recall, Catalyst makes reference to events from the book Tarkin, but that seemed like it was done just to tie them together better.
 
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The Death Star is discussed here and there throughout the novel, and I only ever remember it being referred to as "the battle station," never the Death Star. Moff Tarkin is in charge of Sentinel Base, a moon located somewhere near Geonosis where the battle station is being built. Sentinel, as its name implies, protects Geonosis from potential attack. Tarkin is in charge of security at the time Catalyst ends, and when Tarkin begins. But he is critical of the way the project is going because too many subordinates have their own ideas about what the path things ought to take, and it's Tarkin's opinion that too many cooks spoil the broth (although he phrases it as "too many voices weighing in"). Only when he becomes the grand moff and gains total control of Oversector Outer (or whatever it's called in the new canon) does he have total authority over the project. And only then does it start moving along at something quicker than a snail's pace.
 
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The Death Star is discussed here and there throughout the novel, and I only ever remember it being referred to as "the battle station," never the Death Star. Moff Tarkin is in charge of Sentinel Base, a moon located somewhere near Geonosis where the battle station is being built. Sentinel, as its name implies, protects Geonosis from potential attack. Tarkin is in charge of security at the time Catalyst ends, and when Tarkin begins. But he is critical of the way the project is going because too many subordinates have their own ideas about what the path things ought to take, and it's Tarkin's opinion that too many cooks spoil the broth (although he phrases it as "too many voices weighing in"). Only when he becomes the grand moff and gains total control of Oversector Outer (or whatever it's called in the new canon) does he have total authority over the project. And only then does it start moving along at something quicker than a snail's pace.
Thank you.

I wanted to be sure it was definitely canon before reading it. Not that it has to be, I just want to focus on canon now and I'll catch up on non-canon later.

What surprised me in Rogue One is that they made it seem that the Death Star was entirely Krennic's baby and Tarkin was a serious Doubting Thomas about it who takes over at the last minute when he knows it works. At least that in the way I saw it.

I also have a recollection that his episodes Rebels implied, or even stated, that he had someplace else he need to be rather than Lothal. I was thinking this was overseeing the Death Star. Am I remembering that wrong?
 
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after watching the blu ray a couple times now, it got me thinking cuz that's what us fans do is tear the movie into the little things, after all the major points have been hit upon. I know I'm reading into it too much....probably. But it occurred to me that its a little sad that our heroes, not counting Cassian and most of the other Rebels in the battle of Scarif have no one to miss their passing or really honor their sacrifice. Jyn lost everyone and didn't know any of the Rebels except Cassian. Chirrut and Baze probably know one even knew their names in the Alliance, they just hitched a ride after all. If there was some sort of Rebel memorial to those that died in the battle Chirrut and Baze may just be UNKNOWN. And Bodhi anyone he knew was in the Empire and would look at him as a traitor, no one survived that met him. So kinda sad save the universe but know one around to care who you were or remember.
 
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As often is true with the "real" heroes of any victory, they were unknown or not acknowledged properly.
 
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What surprised me in Rogue One is that they made it seem that the Death Star was entirely Krennic's baby and Tarkin was a serious Doubting Thomas about it who takes over at the last minute when he knows it works. At least that in the way I saw it.
Tarkin mentions he first suggested the idea of the weapon to Palpatine "years ago." He believes in the idea of the Death Star, since it was his idea; the thing he's doubtful of is Krennic's ability to get the thing finished.
 
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Watched it 6 times so far; 3 theatre, 2 regular blu-ray, 1 3D blu-ray. Though filled with nice little moments here and there, after all these viewings I'm starting to form the opinion that the first 2/3rds of the movie has a tendency to drag in a lot of places while I find the last 1/3 some of the best Star Wars action moments ever. It will probably take me years to finally settle on a final movie grade. What I will say now is that I absolutely LOVE watching that final space battle in 3D! The added depth really puts you in the action.
 

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Watched it 6 times so far; 3 theatre, 2 regular blu-ray, 1 3D blu-ray. Though filled with nice little moments here and there, after all these viewings I'm starting to form the opinion that the first 2/3rds of the movie has a tendency to drag in a lot of places while I find the last 1/3 some of the best Star Wars action moments ever. It will probably take me years to finally settle on a final movie grade. What I will say now is that I absolutely LOVE watching that final space battle in 3D! The added depth really puts you in the action.
at can be a good thing.
I think that is a sign of a good movie (but not always). If one has to think about it, th
 
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Watched it 6 times so far; 3 theatre, 2 regular blu-ray, 1 3D blu-ray. Though filled with nice little moments here and there, after all these viewings I'm starting to form the opinion that the first 2/3rds of the movie has a tendency to drag in a lot of places while I find the last 1/3 some of the best Star Wars action moments ever. It will probably take me years to finally settle on a final movie grade. What I will say now is that I absolutely LOVE watching that final space battle in 3D! The added depth really puts you in the action.
Many that is not the movie but the fact that you are watching it too much too often :p

Does anyone know why Mustafar is the only planet not named by on screen text?

I heard some guy complain it was "Prequel shame" but that makes no sense. Why would they use the planet in the firs place if that was the case? There are plenty of other Prequel elements in the film.
 
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after watching the blu ray a couple times now, it got me thinking cuz that's what us fans do is tear the movie into the little things, after all the major points have been hit upon. I know I'm reading into it too much....probably. But it occurred to me that its a little sad that our heroes, not counting Cassian and most of the other Rebels in the battle of Scarif have no one to miss their passing or really honor their sacrifice. Jyn lost everyone and didn't know any of the Rebels except Cassian. Chirrut and Baze probably know one even knew their names in the Alliance, they just hitched a ride after all. If there was some sort of Rebel memorial to those that died in the battle Chirrut and Baze may just be UNKNOWN. And Bodhi anyone he knew was in the Empire and would look at him as a traitor, no one survived that met him. So kinda sad save the universe but know one around to care who you were or remember.
As often is true with the "real" heroes of any victory, they were unknown or not acknowledged properly.
I think Mon Mothma would have ensured a memorial to all involved when the war was over.

She knew Jyn and Cassian personally and Bodhi was at the Council meeting to give evidence, so she'd have details on him too. And I think it safe to say that Draven didn't let Chirrut and Base wonder the base without some information about them.

All the other who volunteered would have had friends friends and comrades that remained on Yavin 4.

Maybe their memory would be overshadowed by the glory of Luke's "one man assault" on the Death Star, but I'm sure they were not forgotten.



Can anyone identify the class of the starship on the lower right side under the Hammerhead Corvette?

I've had a look in the Art of Rogue One book but can't find anything?
 
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Many that is not the movie but the fact that you are watching it too much too often :p

Does anyone know why Mustafar is the only planet not named by on screen text?

I heard some guy complain it was "Prequel shame" but that makes no sense. Why would they use the planet in the firs place if that was the case? There are plenty of other Prequel elements in the film.
To keep Vader's reveal a surprise?
 
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I


Can anyone identify the class of the starship on the lower right side under the Hammerhead Corvette?

I've had a look in the Art of Rogue One book but can't find anything?
I'm pretty sure that's a dreadnaught, could be wrong tho
 
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so after watching a couple times, not sure why it didn't occur to me sooner, if Raddus and fleet had not shown up it seems that the Rogues would've gotten the job done and at least the main cast may have survived. shield may never have gone up and possibly the crew could've been able to stow away aboard another ship.
 
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Stop it!!!!!! :eek:

I want to unread that!

(Though this is similar in some ways to the notion that Tarkin could have just blown up Yavin and most likely taken out the 4th moon along with it...or at least gotten it out of the way to get a clear shot! But no, let's orbit it because it will look cool when we emerge from over the horizon maybe!)
 
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so after watching a couple times, not sure why it didn't occur to me sooner, if Raddus and fleet had not shown up it seems that the Rogues would've gotten the job done and at least the main cast may have survived. shield may never have gone up and possibly the crew could've been able to stow away aboard another ship.
I think their cover still would have been blown when they accessed the data vault. As a security measure the Shield Gate probably would have been closed and remaining resources not fighting the Rebels on the beach at the time (i.e. Krennic's entire Guard Squadron) sent to find the infiltrators and retrieve the data tape.

Now, if somehow they were able to get the data tape without being detected I suppose anything is possible.
 
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To keep Vader's reveal a surprise?
I thought of that but a surprise to who?

The planet seemed instantly recognisable as Mustafar. How many people who wouldn't have recognised the world would have known the name?

Plus, Vader features very promenantly on the poster.

I'm pretty sure that's a dreadnaught, could be wrong tho
Do you mean the dreadnoughts from the Thrawn trilogy? Weren't they supposed to be massive?

so after watching a couple times, not sure why it didn't occur to me sooner, if Raddus and fleet had not shown up it seems that the Rogues would've gotten the job done and at least the main cast may have survived. shield may never have gone up and possibly the crew could've been able to stow away aboard another ship.
The shield was not permanently open. It would have been closed at some point, and there is no way the Imperials would let a ship out without checking it throughly.

Rogue One's only way out once the battle on the beach started would have been to blast their way out and they stood no chance against those StarDestroyers at the gate. They pretty much went in their without an escape plan. Realising they were trapped was pretty much Jyn and Cassian just accepting that.

Plus, sooner or later a commander on one of those Star Destroyers was going to find out about the fighting on the surface and inform Tarkin. And I'm sure Krennic would have ordered the shield gate closed

The fleet attacking simply brought Tarkin sooner. Also, he team on the beach were done for against the walkers until Blue Squadron showed up.

So Raddus did save the day.B)
 
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Tarkin mentions he first suggested the idea of the weapon to Palpatine "years ago." He believes in the idea of the Death Star, since it was his idea; the thing he's doubtful of is Krennic's ability to get the thing finished.
That makes sense B)
 
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has it ever been mentioned how, the republic at the time, got a hold of the plans. Dooku gave it to Sidious, but I was wondering how did he let it fall into the hands of Tarkins without Tarkin knowing the it was Palps giving it to him, since it was Tarkins idea in the first place. at least so he seems to think.
 
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Not the only one. Lah'mu isn't named either. Just saying.:)
Very true.

But why?

Tarkin mentions he first suggested the idea of the weapon to Palpatine "years ago." He believes in the idea of the Death Star, since it was his idea; the thing he's doubtful of is Krennic's ability to get the thing finished.
has it ever been mentioned how, the republic at the time, got a hold of the plans. Dooku gave it to Sidious, but I was wondering how did he let it fall into the hands of Tarkins without Tarkin knowing the it was Palps giving it to him, since it was Tarkins idea in the first place. at least so he seems to think.
I had forgotten that the blueprints show up in Episode II first.

Rogue One doesn't specify whose idea it was, only that Tarkin told the Emperor about it.

Maybe Krennic came to Tarkin during the Clone Wars, Tarkin went to the Emperor and the early plans were stored on Geonosis.

I assuming Catalyst works that connection to Prequels out properly.
 
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And Tarkin was present at the early construction of it at the end of ROTS. He also appeared in TCW, but I don't recall if anything was discussed about then.
 
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And Tarkin was present at the early construction of it at the end of ROTS. He also appeared in TCW, but I don't recall if anything was discussed about then.
No, Death Star is not mentioned in TCW.

There is an unfinished episode about Grievous stealing massive Kyber Crystals for the Death Star though.

Everyone died in the next few minutes so "saving the day" wasn't really all that helpful.
How was it not helpful?

The Alliance would never have got the plans without Raddus and his fleet.

The fighters on the beach were about to be taken out by the walkers. With them gone there'd have been no distraction and Jyn, Cssian & K2 would have to face a lot more opposition. Krennic would have been able to troops to the top of the tower.

So everyone on the beach would have died. And even if Jyn & Cassian made it to a ship there is no way they get passed the Star Destroyers.

And Tarkin had arrived, in response to an "incursion" - not just the fleet but all of it - before Jyn even got out of the tower.

Everyone on the team was dead as soon they passed the shield gate.
 
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