Making a SW Film is Difficult Because of the Lack of Comics and Novels says Kathleen Kennedy!

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What...on God's green Earth...is she talking about? There's no source material? Huh? You had six films of source material to build from when beginning the ST. There's no comics? Um...yes, there are. I'm assuming this is a passive aggressive reference to Disney Marvel. There's no novels? Um, yes there are. Hundreds! You're the people that decided to SCRAP all that and rebuild a new EU. Is she trying to pretend it didn't even exist? How can the PRESIDENT of Lucasfilm NOT KNOW THIS? And while maybe in some ways it's for the better, in other ways it's regrettable. The old EU was hit or miss. But Disney SW has very clearly borrowed from old EU concepts and ideas and just adapted them. They brought Thrawn back just in a different period of time. Rogue One shares a lot in common with Dark Forces. Even Kylo and Rey have some similarities to the Solo children. This, to me, clearly displays that Kennedy really doesn't have much of any familiarity with the franchise or at best it's vaguely so.

But one thing that has always irked me with a lot of post OT era films is that critical plot points surrounding the plot of the films...only gain answers in subsidiary content. Sifo-Dias comes to mind. No! I shouldn't have to buy a book to gain the full picture. The film lore should come first when making...a film...and the EU content is just that, subsidiary. Extra! Not required!
 
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there's more to that interview.

she also said: (re: losing directors mid-way through the process):

"You start by talking to filmmakers who you think exhibit the sensibilities that you're looking for. And I would argue that the list is very small, people who really do have the sensibilities about these kind of movies, and then the experience and the ability to handle how enormous a job these movies are. So we try to be as thoughtful as we possibly can about making those choices. I would also argue that sometimes people get involved in the normal development process, and then they realize, 'Oh, my God, this is so much more than I ever imagined.' So it's pretty common that when you're working on movies, you're not making choices and decisions that necessarily work out exactly the way you want from the get-go."
>>> she is blaming the directors, whom SHE FIRED, for not having the skills to handle making a star wars movie.

There's a lot to pick apart with that statement. The main thing is that she's implying that Colin Trevorrow, and perhaps some of the other directors that have parted ways with Lucasfilm, simply can't handle the development process that goes into making a Star Wars movie. Though, when looking at some of the talent they've lost, that seems a bit hard to believe.

that's kinda like breaking up with a BF/GF, and letting them down easy by saying "...it's not me, it's YOU".

she says, the directors she hired, get so overwhelmed that they simply can't handle it, so that's why she's been FIRING them, without letting them finish their work.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxic_workplace :rolleyes:
 
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there's more to that interview.

she also said: (re: losing directors mid-way through the process):



>>> she is blaming the directors, whom SHE FIRED, for not having the skills to handle making a star wars movie.




that's kinda like breaking up with a BF/GF, and letting them down easy by saying "...it's not me, it's YOU".

she says, the directors she hired, get so overwhelmed that they simply can't handle it, so that's why she's been FIRING them, without letting them finish their work.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxic_workplace :rolleyes:
My man, I think it's finally time, after these statements and I've even heard rumors....after the ST is over....she either retires or is just done. All these TLJ fans talk about toxic fans. We have to here it over and over again. But really, maybe it's a toxic workplace! Maybe she is the sickness. The cancer to this franchise. Because combo all there statements and it shows how much she really cares about the franchise over making a paycheck. Yeah...it's very little.
 
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At the end of ROTJ Yoda tells Luke to train his sister and pass on what he has learned, the Sith were destroyed.....

I think even if they had completely ignored the EU, they had more than enough to start with for the ST with just the previous films and even GL's original ideas way back.
 
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Well KK we have heard you so if you’ll just take your personal items and your experience someplace else we will now start the tough task of taking this monumental SW brain teaser away from you. Please remove all of your personnel and all of there idiotic opinions and ideas as well. We are going to start from scratch here and want no one connected to the previous SW Disney disasters. We wish you and your crew much luck as you destroy other franchises in the future as you have done with this one. And now just two more things, for the millionth time yes and yes we know you got Spielberg coffee on some very successful movies he made in the 80’s and there is no need to keep saying that over and over, finally uhh buhh bye now. (Door slams)
 
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I just can't grasp that the president of Lucasfilm...doesn't think there was source material to build off of. This potentially explains the Holdo maneuver and how it legit breaks the rules of the universe. I mean the prior films ALONE are source material. From prior interviews, she clearly knows of them. The question now becomes...has she ACTUALLY seen them?
 
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the previous president of Lucasfilm was an artist/film-maker. this one is a producer/accountant.
 
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sometimes people get involved in the normal development process, and then they realize, 'Oh, my God, this is so much more than I ever imagined.'

Well, she's so totally right in saying that! People get involved, and then they see all the talentless accountant hacks (esp. the one talking here) meddling with their movie and forcing policy crap on them, and then they realize that this is so much more micromanagement than they ever imagined...

I'm kinda tired of that person.
 
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Having read the article, I don't think she is "complaining" that there is no source material. She's stating that what she is trying to do is hard because she made a decision to not use any pre-existing source material and they are trying to make it from scratch. "There's no source materials [for the story I'm trying to tell]" is the way I would phrase it.. As if to say she decided on taking a harder path to make the ST movies and maybe people on the outside looking in don't realize it. My only response is, you've made your bed, now lie in it.
 
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There are thousands of pages of references in the old West End Games source books from the RPG. too many words for her and not enough pictures to color? What a cop out.
 
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Okay, but why is it the Director's fault for not being prepared? They obviously passed Kathleen's hiring process, she's a Producer etc. So she should know talent. Also, why is it that Marvel is able to find competent Directors from names that some of us haven't ever heard of?
 
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To be honest, I think the comment about "not having an 800-page book...." was more of a potshot at Benoiff & Weiss as opposed to anything having to do with starting uo the ST. I think KK latched on to RJ too quickly before TLJ even came out and basically said RJ is getting his own trilogy and all. Then at some point Iger or someone at Disney announced B%W were getting a trilogy and KK may have felt miffed by that.
 
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It's interesting that she's got a Director in mind for that 22 film, yet I am reading rumor that she's on the way out in either 21-22. And that Favreau might be in consideration. A friend told me about this yesterday.
 
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As I type this, I am looking at two shelves of comics and books from SW she could of used. Anyway...KK Sequels literally killed SW for me, a guy who has been a fan since he was a kid and saw the original. But for the last 4 years I haven't cared about it at all, I don't get excited about the new movies and it was all her. I never even saw TLJ or Solo and have no desire to, because I hated TFA and the awful new characters that badly.

Rogue One however was a really good movie, and (so far) the Mandalorian by Favreau and Filoini has been excellent. I also get if I am going to blame her for the things I hate since she is in charge, I have to also give her credit for not screwing up the things I liked. But reading this article, she is as clueless as ever. I often wonder how much George regrets his duel decision to sell off SW to Disney and put her in charge? I think it gets to him pretty bad.
 
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Frankly, I don't think she's doing any worse than he did during the prequels. At least she's managed to put out three things I enjoyed.
 
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Frankly, I don't think she's doing any worse than he did during the prequels. At least she's managed to put out three things I enjoyed.
Oh I don't disagree. The PT is very flawed. Here's how I put it:

The Force Awakens: A solid comeback. While certainly safely played, basically more a reboot than a sincere sequel, but I get why it was so derivative. After a decade of fans split on the PT, it mostly getting more negative notice in the press to almost cliche levels after a time, they wanted to reunite the fans and show that classic SW had returned. One way to do that, basically draw from said originals. So...I got it. I enjoyed it. The open-ended quality didn't bother me at the time as I believed things would be answered as the trilogy continued. It was a bit jarring that Rey beat Kylo, but I rolled with it under the belief it'll be explained at a later date instead of her simply being a Mary Sue. So at the time, it was my favorite SW since the originals. Now in retrospect, The Last Jedi actually wounds The Force Awakens for me just due to the lack of proper explanations.

Rogue One: To this date, I'd argue it's the best since the originals. A lot of fans seem to be of the belief that Rogue One and The Mandalorian are the best of the new SW content and I think that reflects where the franchise should perhaps go. The franchise doesn't require Jedi and Sith to be compelling and investing. Do we really need everything to be dedicated to a "force" story?

The Last Jedi: Complete cinematic abomination that, for my money, is actually worse than even the PT. It's the bottom of the SW barrel.

Solo: I've got issues with the film, it's a story I don't think needed told, but I was entertained. It's fun. It's nothing exceptional IMO, but it's worthy of a watch and even a few re-watchings.

So I would say, Disney SW IMO isn't batting as poorly as people say, certainly not as poorly as Lucas did in the late 90's and early 2000's, it's just that Disney just so happened to also produce the absolute worst one ever made.
 
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True, it's not exactly like they have released total B. O. failures similar to the last two Terminator. And they seem to appeal to passerby types who have no vested interest. Sadly there's just noting noteworthy about them to write home about. While TFA was the safe route, it didn't offer something new and interesting that I was after. TLJ came along and well...
 

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Having read the article, I don't think she is "complaining" that there is no source material. She's stating that what she is trying to do is hard because she made a decision to not use any pre-existing source material and they are trying to make it from scratch. "There's no source materials [for the story I'm trying to tell]" is the way I would phrase it.. As if to say she decided on taking a harder path to make the ST movies and maybe people on the outside looking in don't realize it. .
To be honest, I think the comment about "not having an 800-page book...." was more of a potshot at Benoiff & Weiss as opposed to anything having to do with starting uo the ST.
This is all mostly what I've read from it. Beinoff and Weiss did notably worse without George R. R. Martin's writing to fall back on, you know. I think it's a way of saying Game of Thrones and its imitations, as well as some of the earlier Marvel films (before they've branched out more) all had an advantage of being adaptions of stories told in other mediums, whereas these are much more ambitious than simply filming a modified version of Heir to the Empire with changes. Sometimes in adaptions, mediocre writing or directing can be bridged by the strength of the source material being drawn upon. Someone who can barely set a scene dressing up a scene from a book can still make money.

A seventh Star Wars film for theaters was never going to be an adaption of an existing novel though; even the later expanded universe was so heavily built on the earlier works that making a film with an older original cast and Jacen, Jaina, Anakin and Ben would have still required a different story, not words lifted from a page.

As for losing directors, well, I think she's delivering a very nothing answer to avoid talking about the real questions, so I wouldn't spend time analyzing it. It's a failed effort to keep it classy by not going into details. It makes her look like an idiot, but she'd also look like an idiot to say, 'Gee golly, I wish we'd kept Collin!'. In the specific cases, I've always felt Edwards' role in Rogue One has been unfairly minimized, and I've blamed Solo on the conflict with Kasdan heavily rumored, because it's in line with things I've already known about everyone involved. I don't think we'll be able to understand the conflict surrounding the ninth film until we see what comes out of the oven; then we can go back over the recipe. I don't really hold Kathleen Kennedy fully responsible for two of the three controversies in short, not to mention the time crunch, which from the sound of it is actually Bob Iger's doing.
 
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At this point, Disney really doesn't want to rock the boat, so toeing the line and saying TLJ was what they had been planning all along won't upset the people who actually liked it and those who didn't like it have either been lost already or are willing to give JJ a chance or will see TROS just to see how it ends.

Come 2020, when TROS has made its final bow at cinemas worldwide, I figure we'll start to hear other tones from those involved in these projects. Sure, some will continue to toe the line and all, but if changes are really being made at LFL, then I'm sure there is some concern with the property.
 
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A seventh Star Wars film for theaters was never going to be an adaption of an existing novel though; even the later expanded universe was so heavily built on the earlier works that making a film with an older original cast and Jacen, Jaina, Anakin and Ben would have still required a different story, not words lifted from a page.
Don't forget that Lucas had an outline for the ST story, that Disney ignored.
 
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according to GL, those outlines were focused heavily on the "Whills" -- a society of microscopic life forms, from a microscopic universe, who reside inside "all living cells" (and can communicate with "force-sensitive" people via midichlorians -- not unlike "Horton Hears a Who"). the midichlorians were just the mechanism by which these tiny life-forms would communicate with a force-sensitive Jedi... but qui-gon's "will of the force" actually comes from the Whills, not the midichlorians.
 
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I'd take a story about midi-chlorians causing an extreme case of diarrhea to half the population of Coruscant over what we got in TLJ.
True that :) I do think that ol' Georgie boy could have made it feel like Star Wars though. That feeling is nowhere to be found in the Disney Trilogy, perhaps in glimpses but that's it.
 
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according to GL, those outlines were focused heavily on the "Whills" -- a society of microscopic life forms, from a microscopic universe, who reside inside "all living cells" (and can communicate with "force-sensitive" people via midichlorians -- not unlike "Horton Hears a Who"). the midichlorians were just the mechanism by which these tiny life-forms would communicate with a force-sensitive Jedi... but qui-gon's "will of the force" actually comes from the Whills, not the midichlorians.
oh my .. that sounds like boring dumpster fire movies. It really was his outline for 7, 8 and 9?
 
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it comes from the james cameron interview for his TV show "the story of science fiction"

GL said: "

“Everyone hated it in Phantom Menace [when] we started to talk about midi-chlorians.... There’s a whole aspect to that movie that is about symbiotic relationships. To make you look and see that we aren’t the boss. That there’s an ecosystem.”

“[The next three Star Wars films] were going to get into a microbiotic world... there’s this world of creatures that operate differently than we do. I call them the Whills. And the Whills are the ones who actually control the universe. They feed off the Force.”

“Back in the day, I used to say ultimately what this means is we were just cars, vehicles for the Whills to travel around,” Lucas tells Cameron. “We’re vessels for them. And the conduct is the midi-chlorians. The midi-chlorians are the ones that communicate with the Whills. The Whills, in a general sense, they are the Force.”

“If I’d held onto the company I could have done it, and then it would have been done,” Lucas says. ”Of course, a lot of the fans would have hated it, just like they did Phantom Menace and everything, but at least the whole story from beginning to end would be told.”






 
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it comes from the james cameron interview for his TV show "the story of science fiction"

GL said: "

“Everyone hated it in Phantom Menace [when] we started to talk about midi-chlorians.... There’s a whole aspect to that movie that is about symbiotic relationships. To make you look and see that we aren’t the boss. That there’s an ecosystem.”

“[The next three Star Wars films] were going to get into a microbiotic world... there’s this world of creatures that operate differently than we do. I call them the Whills. And the Whills are the ones who actually control the universe. They feed off the Force.”

“Back in the day, I used to say ultimately what this means is we were just cars, vehicles for the Whills to travel around,” Lucas tells Cameron. “We’re vessels for them. And the conduct is the midi-chlorians. The midi-chlorians are the ones that communicate with the Whills. The Whills, in a general sense, they are the Force.”

“If I’d held onto the company I could have done it, and then it would have been done,” Lucas says. ”Of course, a lot of the fans would have hated it, just like they did Phantom Menace and everything, but at least the whole story from beginning to end would be told.”



I'm actually glad he didn't get to finish that. That sounds soo way off what people like about Star Wars.
I know he didn't make the films for the fanbase, but I feel he would have lost it completely with that trippy-chlorian history. It would probably have put Lucasfilm in the same situation as it is now.
 
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I'm pretty sure the whole new Trilogy that GL had in mind didn't only have to do with midichlorians. They would have been a big part of it no doubt (as he alluded to them in all of the PT movies) but we weren't going to see some Sea Monkey's Trilogy.
 
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Personally, I never want to see Lucas anywhere near Star Wars again. Well, not without a strict handler anyway. It's terrible to say such a thing because the guy gave us Star Wars in the first place, but over the years I read so much about George Lucas's crazy ideas that had to be bypassed or just flat out refused, that I think he cannot simply be let do things with really strict supervision. Those ideas weren't just limited to Star Wars either. 'Raiders of the Lost Ark' would have been rubbish too, if there weren't more level heads involved.

I'm absolutely convinced that Gary Kurtz was responsible for filtering much of Lucas' vision for the original Star Wars movies and without him (and others), they would have been just awful.

If Lucas had been let produce his Midichlorian Star Wars, it would have been a disaster. A bigger disaster than Diswars has been. At least with the Mouse, things have been so scattershot that there was a chance that something good would come of it, and we ended up with 'Rogue One' and 'The Mandalorian'. I don't think that would have happened if Lucas had continued in a role that had any sort of power.

We all have to be honest here. The man had it. But, somewhere in the 90's he lost it. Or maybe he never really had it and it was only through collaboration that the projects he was involved in were good?

On the topic of Kennedy and "no source", I can only echo the disbelief that has been bandied about in the wake of her comments. It shows clearly that she's absolutely clueless with Star Wars and doesn't know what the hell to do with it. Now that being said, from what I've seen of the expanded universe I can safely say that much of it - perhaps the vast majority - was utter crap. But, there are entire books written about lore alone that could have been mined for ideas to support a better set of sequels than the ones we ended up with and the very fact that she was responsible for throwing out the entirety of the expanded universe in 2015 makes her remarks all the more bewildering.

In the end, I can no longer offer her any kind of defence for her custodianship of this franchise. Not that I was offering a strong defence in the first place, but there's no doubt in my mind now that she needs to be moved on. She had a shot at running one of the hottest tickets in town and buggered it up through sheer ignorance.
 
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re: Kurtz

I was thinking the exact same thing this weekend. as part of our weekly star wars marathon leading up to episode 9, we watched ROTJ this week. a friend of mine (a casual fan) brings her daughter (also a casual fan) and we all sit down and watch one SW movie per week. it's kind of a treat for me, to experience their reactions, to witness SW through the eyes of 'casual fans', as if I'm watching for the very first time.

last week was ESB, and everyone was blown away by how well this movie has stood the test of time. we were all completely engaged through the entire film ("Luke, I Am Your Father!!"), and when it was all over, everyone was literally gushing over how good it was -- everyone was PUMPED to see the next episode. the excitement was palpable, as our guests left the house, with smiles all around, like it was 1980 all over again.

one week later, with ALL the same people present, we were all watching ROTJ in stunned silence. often shaking our heads at how BAD it was. every 'burp-and-fart-joke' fell flat; serious moments evoked snorts of laughter ("Luke, I Am Your Sister!?"); the slapstick ekok battle had our guests humming the theme from Benny Hill, as punctuation for the 1970's-TV-Quality scene; etc.... after the relatively 'serious' tone of SW and ESB, there was NO WAY we could take this one seriously... it was laughably, horribly, BAD in comparison.

when held in stark contrast to SW and ESB, there is a MARKED difference in the franchise when it comes to ROTJ -- my friend asked "What Happened"...? was THIS the moment when GL lost control of the franchise, and everything went spiraling out of his control, at the hands of a corporate comittee...? "No" I explained, THIS was the moment when GL actually took control of the franchise, and fired Gary Kurtz -- this is what happens, when GL goes unchecked -- it extends into the prequels (which is exactly why everyone hates the prequels).

this week, there was no 'palpable excitement' as our guests left the house -- it was more like we had all just sat through a funeral, with comments like "tha's too bad" and "it's such a shame, the way things turned out" -- this time, the DISAPPOINTMENT in the room was palpable. (like 1983 all over again).




>> next week is TFA. my friend has already cancelled. :( thus ends the weekly Star Wars marathon. 😂 LOL

(I blame ROTJ --- For Everything!) :ROFLMAO: LOL
 
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Yeh Gary Kurtz happened, or rather didn't happen, and we got Death Star 2 and teddy bears...coz toys.

Even so, I still like 'Return of the Jedi', but only in its original form.
 
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100% agreed on Gary Kurtz. I've said it before, but just to recap...they did release George's original draft for Star Wars in comic format and frankly, my God is it interesting...in how utterly terrible it is. In MANY ways, it's somewhat akin to TPM. There's just no chance the franchise would have been as successful if they went with nothing but unchecked Lucas. What created the genius of the OT was collaboration. Lucas wasn't deified at that time, people weren't afraid to say "Ah George, that's ****ing awful." In fact, I doubt it would have BEEN a franchise to begin with if Lucas had as much control then as he did on the PT. I really think that Lucas is someone who needs restricted. When unchained and unquestioned you get things like the PT. Brilliant ideas, designs, and concepts but everything else? Well...we know how that went. Lucas needs kept in check. I think it's just undeniable at this point that Lucas gets too much credit for SW OT and basically everyone else (besides actors) gets far too little. I agree that I still like, heck I even love ROTJ, warts and all. But there's no denying that that was the first really affair with blatant script ideas included FOR merchandising. It's the selling out moment. Sure the prior two were heavily marketed too, from underoos to action figures, but I find it clear that the story took presidency in Star Wars and Empire. Jedi is the first example of an inclusion that's literally there firstly TO sell toys, secondly for story, not the vice versa: Ewoks. Now for me, I think Jedi is still a great story, it's just the first instance of what was to come. Gary was gone then...but Lucas still had to relatively adhere to the established lore. He could only go sooooo far. So cut to over a decade later and Phantom Menace is release, now Lucas has full control and it's a new beginning and now? Now he can basically just go ***** to the wall. Phantom Menace feels like a giant toy commercial at times. The whole thing became so commercial and superficial once he was in-charge that it actually makes ROTJ almost feel somewhat subtle. The true Jedi of SW is Gary Kurtz, the true hero. Whereas it's utterly ironic that the life and ideologies and core beliefs as an artist back in 1977 became the exact opposite of what Lucas became. He basically birthed a film-making evil corporate Empire. He's the Anakin falling to the darkside, Gary the Yoda or Obi-Wan just...running away to hide.
 
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in 1977 he sold toys to promote his movie -- but by 1983 he was using his movies to sell toys. and I'm sure if you analyze the top-selling toys in history, the 'Generic Teddy Bear' (or stuffed bear) is one of the most prolific, top-selling "toys" of all time. this seems to be the underlying premise of GL's writing process, re: 'Ewoks' -- rather than making toys from his popular movie-characters, he began writing movie characters from popular toys. (I suppose it could be worse -- he could have given us the SW equivalent of a 'Generic Rubber Ball' -- instead we have JJ to thank for that one. LOL)
 
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Now I'm just picturing new SW characters that look like basically Pokemon. One alien is a yoyo, another a frizbee, someone has a lightsaber baseball glove. Yeah absolutely the teddy bear is one of the most iconic "cliche generic" toys too. It's ripe for marketing. Agreed, when once it was about selling toys to promote the film, the opposite became true. Jedi started it, but it was still predominately in its infancy IMO. The ewoks still have a role to play in the story, a crucial one, albeit mildly ridiculous. I still LOVE ROTJ, I just recognize the warts. But once you get to the prequels, there are times when I wonder if certain aspects of characters are in this for NO point BUT commercialism.
 
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I just made myself laugh, how tacky but what the heck. I just imagine a droid who's basically just generic children's building blocks, it gets destroyed and has to be rebuilt all the time. Hah! Now THAT'S marketing! Lego ...eat your heart out!
 
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