Page 3 of 25 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 250

Thread: Hidalgo On Luke In The Sequels

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by HothHan View Post
    TLJ sucked. I'm hopeful that TROS won't suck.
    My thoughts as well, but at this point I think I'm just looking forward to the ST being finished and out of the way.
    #1 want: Admiral Piett (3.75" TVC line)

    I'd like to exercise my right to free speech, but I really don't have anything to say at the moment.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by MysterioMaximus View Post
    You know, when I posted the first reply to this...I was so certain I'd be chewed a new one. Now I'm sure I'll inevitably be flamed by someone eventually, but I must have severely underestimated the hatred for this scene. At least around Rebelscum. Now by no means am I saying that someone is stupid or wrong for enjoying it, but I am saying...I cannot possibly fathom how they could enjoy it. To each their own.
    Sure, everyone likes different things.

    Quote Originally Posted by MysterioMaximus View Post
    Now one thing is fascinating to me: for many years I felt like the fandom, while very much enjoying the character of Luke Skywalker, he wasn't on many top favorite characters lists. You'd more so see comments discussing how he's whiny, he's white bread, it's the straight-man POV role, and how he's somewhat boring and generic.
    Nobody ever considered Luke "whiny", until the prequels came out and that kind accusation was levelled at Hayden's portrayal of Anakin Skywalker. The prequel fans started to point at Luke and his Toshe Station yap when Uncle Owen gave out to him about wasting time with his friends and say look, Luke was whiny too, so that makes it all ok. It's the same type of whataboutery that sequel fans use to big up their own particular likes, when people say that Rey is overpowered.

    But, none of the comparisons with either Rey or Anakin stands up to any analysis.

    Luke is frustrated, at times, in the first two films, no doubt. But I think he's legitimately so in 'Star Wars', because his Uncle is actively holding him back in that movie. In 'The Empire Strikes Back', he's frustrated by Yoda, who's testing his patience. But Luke has the patience of every 20 year old, i.e. bleedin none. But his frustration stems from Yoda not really being straight with him, too, and when Yoda does play straight, Luke's attitude changes. By the third film, Luke has matured into fairly admirable young man.

    Teenage Anakin, on the other hand, is just a deeply unpleasant person from the moment we meet him. He's just an awful ****** who is constantly at odds with everyone around him who's trying to teach him and he turns into a flippin psychopath.

    In any case, I was one of those people who was never really that interested in Luke Skywalker (or the Jedi for that matter). My draw was always Han Solo and the war aspect of Star Wars. That was the side of things that always fascinated me. The war between the Rebellion and the Empire was endless more fascinating to me than space wizards. The Jedi and the Force were always just parts of a greater whole to me, because in the original films that's what they were. When the focus became about the Jedi order in the prequels, I mostly tuned out, because they're largely boring, arrogant, pseudo mystical tossers and nothing at all like what Alec Guinness's Obi-Wan suggested. Which is why I suppose I am more interested in Disney's TV Star Wars fare than I am in their movie output.

    I suppose that's why I also don't really find the sequels that appealing, because Rey is just an instant Jedi superhero, without any of the trials and tribulations that go with the journey. Which makes her terribly uninteresting. And with the other aspects of the sequels being just a poor retread of the Empire vs Rebels, all without the basic logic of such a conflict being applied and the complete abandonment of any kind of clarity on the galactic political situation, there's not much there for more to care about. It all feels like a soulless, but glossy veneer over very poor quality wood.

    Quote Originally Posted by MysterioMaximus View Post
    I believe only Rogue One achieved the balance, adhering to the sandbox rules, playing off of but not relying on nostalgia, but also being unique enough to free fresh and yet not out of place in this universe.
    'Rogue One' will stand the test of time and with great ease too. In comparison the sequel trilogy will continue to disappoint fans, the more they objectively analyse it and the older they get. 'Rogue One', though, gets better with each viewing and has seamlessly slotted itself into the over all story in a way that the sequels can never even hope to achieve. And that's despite the fact that the main original trilogy characters even make an appearance! Which is mental, when you stop and think about it.

    But, 'Rogue One' is what it is because Gareth Edwards was a genuine fan of the original films. Yes, I know Tony Gilroy did some reshoots and rearranged the ending structure on Scariff. But that film feels the way it does because of Edwards and his love of the 1977 film. Gilroy, himself, said he had no interest in Star Wars at all, if I recall correctly. So, while some people are quick to point out his involvement, it's still very much Gareth Edward's film.

    Personally, I'd give Edward's another Star Wars gig in heartbeat.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by HothHan View Post
    TLJ sucked. I'm hopeful that TROS won't suck.

    I liked TFA.
    Honestly, it wouldn't matter to me if 'The Rise of Skywalker' was the greatest Star Wars film ever made, because it's still a part of a rotten trilogy of films.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Trooper31 View Post
    Well said. It seems to me that RJ's sole reason for starting the film right after TFA, was to have Luke toss the lightsaber over his shoulder. Those "gotcha" moments were a travesty for such an iconic character.

    From what I've read of the Lucas outline, Luke still had a connection to the force, which JJ had originally planned for TFA, but change the scene a bit because RJ asked him too. I don't think JJ knew what RJ had planned anyway. The outline also has Luke training Kira or whatever her name was, meaning what was done in TLJ did not really come from GL.

    I still think they should have had the old mains basically just say to the younger ones, "we did our part years ago, it's your turn." Having Han and Chewie go to Starkiller Base put them front and center. When the OT mains show up onscreen and take the reins, I instantly lose interest in the new ST characters.
    This is why Luke wasn't in TFA much according to JJ himself. Every time he showed up in the script he became the sole focus. What JJ didn't realize is that Harrison Ford's Han Solo was even BIGGER than Luke. I think they were so happy to get Harrison back into Han Solo that they didn't care.

    The "Chewie, we're home" moment that they showed at Celebration still gives me goosebumps and I was only watching on my computer at home when the announcement was made. If they wanted people to care about Finn, Poe, Rey, etc... they needed to have them act on something without the OT characters or at the direction of instead of being led by (if that makes sense). TFA became the movie where Han died and we are introduced to a new Empire that gets its superweapon blown up. TLJ became that movie where Luke has lost hope and the Empire 'strikes back'. Anyone notice what's missing? (Rey was a good addition to Star Wars in my opinion, but even the nice work Daisy did in TFA was overshadowed by everything Harrison did).

    Then they decided to separate the 3 'main' ST characters and give them very little to do. Poe is stuck on a big starship, Rey is literally on an island, and Finn goes on a kooky adventure with generic mechanic.

    This is perhaps the root of what went wrong for me.
    "The Marvel and Transformers team must share a lunch table.
    Star Wars must have sat with GI Joe team." ~ indysolo007


    http://starwarslists.blogspot.com/

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by CellBlock1138 View Post
    Honestly, it wouldn't matter to me if 'The Rise of Skywalker' was the greatest Star Wars film ever made, because it's still a part of a rotten trilogy of films.
    I disagree because I believe they can still make a great Star Wars movie. I don't necessarily think the people working on this have it in them, but they COULD.

    1) Forget about the OT stuff in this one, you wrecked most of that already. Hopefully Leia and Lando are cameos and they don't get blown up with Chewie in the Falcon. (Highly doubtful though since the Falcon is part of Galaxy's Edge and they aren't getting rid of that ship)
    2) Keep the main ST characters together. Think about it: Han, Luke, Leia, Chewie on the Death Star. Han, Luke, Leia, Chewie on Hoth. Han, Leia, Chewie, and eventually Luke on Bespin. Han, Luke, Leia, Chewie in Jabba's Palace. Han, Luke, Leia, Chewie on Endor.
    3) New hotness. Think about it: ANH (X-Wing, TIE, Falcon, Landspeeder, Sandcrawler, Star Destroyer, Death Star) ESB (Snowspeeder, AT-AT, Cloud Car, Slave I) ROTJ (Sailbarge, AT-ST, Speeder bikes, Imp Shuttle) THEN look at what we got in TFA (Rey's speeder, new X-wings and TIEs, Falcon, *a couple just offscreen vehicles) TLJ (Star Destroyers chasing giant resistance ships, Bombers?, Kylo's ship, Finn's shuttle?) In the PT we got Clone Gunships, Octuptarra, Hailfire, Crab, and Homing Spider Droids, Naboo fighters, STAPs, Jedi Starfighters, the list goes on.

    There are plenty of things they can do to get a decent movie out there and they can fix some glaring mistakes as well. It looks like they are already fixing the hole a dead Snoke has left with Palpatine's ghost or something. They can give Rey a lineage and Kylo some redeeming qualities and give Finn some dignity..... lots of ways to heal.
    "The Marvel and Transformers team must share a lunch table.
    Star Wars must have sat with GI Joe team." ~ indysolo007


    http://starwarslists.blogspot.com/

  6. #26
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    It still wouldn't matter to me. All of the above could happen and, indeed, it could be the greatest Star Wars film ever made. But the damage is already done.

  7. #27
    I mean, for me, I already think the TROS looks better...but I'm kind of with CellBlock here. See the thing is, no matter how much it can mend some of the mistakes made with TLJ, it can't fix them all. The damage indeed is done, but I also think that it being the middle of a trilogy hurts the trilogy even more. I feel like the middle installment is the one you don't want to mess up most. While true, Attack of the Clones also sucks, the difference is pretty much all of those do so it makes little difference. Here, the middle installment being bad now taints the enjoyment and step-up's of the first, but also leave you not really caring about the characters by the third. You can't just edit this one out like you basically can with TPM due to that too.
    Last edited by MysterioMaximus; 07-30-2019 at 01:13 PM.
    'But I don’t want to go among mad people,’ Alice remarked. ‘Oh, you can’t help that,’ said the Cat: ‘We’re all mad here. I’m mad, you’re mad.’ ‘How do you know I’m mad?’ said Alice. ‘You must be,’ said the Cat, ‘or you wouldn’t have come here.’ - Lewis Carroll 'Alice's Adventures in Wonderland'

  8. #28
    ^^ I hoping we CAN just edit this one out.LOL

    after all : there was a 3-year gap between SW and ESB -- as if we had missed an episode in between
    the Rebel Fleet is no longer on Yavin; Our Heroes are on the run; and the audience has to 'fill in the blanks', and just roll with it.
    (( we don't need to actually SEE the "bounty hunter on ord mantell" -- we can figure it out for ourselves)).

    by the same token, if one were to watch TFA, and follow directly into TROS, there WOULD be a gap -- as if we had missed an episode in between.
    but the audience could always just 'fill in the blanks and just roll with it.
    (( we don't actually need to SEE the rebel fleet being reduced to just one ship -- we can figure it out for ourselves))

    all told, there's really not much that actually happens in TLJ (besides Luke's death).
    the events of TLJ could be reduced to a single line of dialog, on par with "that nest of gundarks", and the audience could just roll with it -- 'as if we had missed an episode in between' LOL
    "Is there anyone on this ship, who even remotely, looks like Satan?" -- James Kirk, U.S.S. Enterprise.

  9. #29
    Wow, the bile of this thread.

    To quote Lisa Simpson on Comic Book Guy:

    “His favorite thing is Star Wars, and he HATES Star Wars.”

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by ZX3 View Post
    Wow, the bile of this thread.

    To quote Lisa Simpson on Comic Book Guy:

    “His favorite thing is Star Wars, and he HATES Star Wars.”
    So it begins! We finally got our first TLJ fan in the thread! LYNCH HIM! =P

    I'm teasing of course, but sometimes you fans of the film seem to exaggeratedly act like we'll do that. Of course not, I welcome constructive debate. It always fascinates me when someone finally comes along and immediately dismisses criticism as somehow...harmful or unhealthy...because they just don't agree. That whole contemporary concept of "toxic fandom," eye-rolling at best. You have to like every Star Wars to be a Star Wars fan? That cultist brand loyalty mentality is what's unhealthy, not film critique. Do you like every episode of the Simpsons? But your logic, if you don't, guess you should be stripped of your rights to use a Simpsons quote. =P

    How bile indeed.
    Last edited by MysterioMaximus; 07-31-2019 at 01:15 AM.
    'But I don’t want to go among mad people,’ Alice remarked. ‘Oh, you can’t help that,’ said the Cat: ‘We’re all mad here. I’m mad, you’re mad.’ ‘How do you know I’m mad?’ said Alice. ‘You must be,’ said the Cat, ‘or you wouldn’t have come here.’ - Lewis Carroll 'Alice's Adventures in Wonderland'

Page 3 of 25 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •