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View Full Version : Bye Bye Private Feedback -- Yay Ebay!



tykrazen
10-03-2006, 07:53 AM
New Ebay Policy Change (http://www2.ebay.com/aw/core/200610.shtml#2006-10-02120653)

It's about time -- Ebay is getting rid of private feedback for sellers come the end of the month!

ClankTheRobot
10-03-2006, 08:15 AM
It's about time. What's the point of Feedback if no one can see it?

dlloyd
10-03-2006, 08:43 AM
Private auctions and sellers with private feedback... Never bothered me too much as it just says "We steal your money" to me.

SABRESEDGE
10-03-2006, 10:40 AM
Yaaaayyyy!Looks like some SW dealers are gonna freak when their repro stuff is called out for the world to see. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif

MexicanToys
10-03-2006, 10:49 AM
That is great news!!!

Bad seller would be afraid.

Thanks for post the new

Phil72
10-03-2006, 11:07 AM
A step in the right direction for sure! http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/laugh.gif.....only bad sellers need to worry about it.

Lafos
10-03-2006, 11:08 AM
Good news for buyers and reliable dealers !

Shanester
10-03-2006, 01:02 PM
I never understood "private" feedback anyway. Isn't the purpose of feedback to be a public record of the persons past dealings?!

tykrazen
10-03-2006, 01:14 PM
Ebay originally created it to provide privacy for buyers of embarassing items. Within hours of it being launched some of the most notorious sellers had it on their selling accounts.

Jorge
10-03-2006, 01:15 PM
what i don't understand, is someone who has perfect feedback, yet private. what's the point of that?

and they can still have private auctions... where the bidder is hidden. that's where the shady stuff happens, because no one can contact the bidders to tell them it's fake.

feedback i'm not so worried about. but at least it's a step in the right direction.

Leif_G
10-03-2006, 01:23 PM
Doesn't look like they are getting rid of private feedback all together, just restricting people with private feedback from selling.

LandoFrychickien
10-03-2006, 03:53 PM
yeah, that's the way to go, Sellers should not be able to hide feedback, and if buyers choose to use it to hide bad feedback then at least a seller has the right to cancle bidders who's feedback is private. er something.

JOHN_ROLLINS
10-03-2006, 05:51 PM
It is really no big deal. most sellers who flip have two ebay accounts. one to buy with and one to sell. just look at onetwofivedayauctions he has been doing it for years.

michael_mensinger
10-03-2006, 06:23 PM
I think the removal of private feedback for sellers is a step in the right direction, but as other have mentioned, I too would like to see the removal of the private auction format as well.

-Mike

E_CHU_TA
10-03-2006, 09:33 PM
i thought they used the excuse of having people not know who won it for collectors that dont want people to know what they have.
though i think its all bs.

what i have always wanted ebay to do is, when you look at someones feedback and it says so many negatives i want to be able to click on that and see just the negatives instead of hunting for them all 10 pages back.
because sometimes some one has a great feedback but 6 negatives all from 1 customer, but they have positives from 300 people.
so you can guess that just because one person was upset about something doesnt mean they are actually unreliable.
and other times people have 10 badfeedbacks and you want to look and see if they all say basically the same thing because then its a good indicator that its probably true.

faith4ever
10-04-2006, 12:26 AM
I totally agree. I've always wanted the opp to see just the neutrals or the negatives without having to literally sift through pages upon pages of feedback. Especially if the negs are more than 30 days old.

This is defintely a move in the right direction for eBay. Perhaps for adult-oriented items have something which gives an option for a private auction, but everything else should be open to the public.

shameonyou
10-04-2006, 02:25 AM
Those are some great news.
It will make it harder for the "bad" sellers to make their moves.
Great news.

Matt_T
10-04-2006, 05:32 AM
I don't know what to think about this. Should Ebay be congratulated for partially fixing a retarded process? IMO the whole private feedback thing is ridiculous - (Yes, its been said before) What is the point of having feedback that can't be read?

In the policy change statement, they said private feedback was for ones who were so concernced about a feedback comment impacting them, that they had to keep it hidden until it could be resolved. So, in other words it was intended for sellers to protect themselves. Now a seller who keeps their feedback private can't sell. So Ebay has negated the original purpose of private feedback - not by eliminating the process, but by adding rules to it. Just amazing.

dlloyd
10-04-2006, 06:34 AM
What is the point of having feedback that can't be read?



I can see the point in a buyer being able to make feedback from individual auctions private. You might be embarrassed about buying books about, say, morris dancing or train spotting and not want people to be able to see your purchases.

sotoam
10-04-2006, 08:28 AM
i thought they used the excuse of having people not know who won it for collectors that dont want people to know what they have.
though i think its all bs.

what i have always wanted ebay to do is, when you look at someones feedback and it says so many negatives i want to be able to click on that and see just the negatives instead of hunting for them all 10 pages back.
because sometimes some one has a great feedback but 6 negatives all from 1 customer, but they have positives from 300 people.
so you can guess that just because one person was upset about something doesnt mean they are actually unreliable.
and other times people have 10 badfeedbacks and you want to look and see if they all say basically the same thing because then its a good indicator that its probably true.



Some people make auctions private because after the auction a lot of phishing takes place if the item sold for enough money. I sold a comic collection that went for quite a bit of money. I think I got e-mail from 10 bidders asking if I was the one that sent them the "Second Chance Offer". Needless to say, I was not.

blutch
10-04-2006, 09:00 AM
Well I think that it is a step in the right direction. I have reported this issue to ebay several times and perhaps others have done so aswell and many tiny drops make an ocean. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif

The option to make bidders ID's private is also a shady business though and must also be removed. It happened to me recently when a guy selling a fake red Bib Fortuna cape used it after I had informed him that it was fake. I even sent some pictures. He replied that it was real because his father and Mark Hamill had been close friends in the 80's. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/laugh.gif And then changed to a private auction. And I totally bought the story that Mark Hamill was carying around pinkish Prototype Lili Ledy capes with green stitches... Makes sense... http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smirk.gif http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/laugh.gif http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
Luckily the guy had set a reserve so high that it wasn't sold. Unless he tried again... http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Anyway, why not use private feedback for adult auctions only but never for other auctions? That would make it more difficult for scammers.

Matt_T
10-04-2006, 11:18 AM
What is the point of having feedback that can't be read?



I can see the point in a buyer being able to make feedback from individual auctions private. You might be embarrassed about buying books about, say, morris dancing or train spotting and not want people to be able to see your purchases.





Some people make auctions private because after the auction a lot of phishing takes place if the item sold for enough money. I sold a comic collection that went for quite a bit of money. I think I got e-mail from 10 bidders asking if I was the one that sent them the "Second Chance Offer". Needless to say, I was not.



I see what you are saying, buy IMO this is a different issue, and another policy of Ebay's that I don't agree with. Items that a person wins should not be viewable by others - but the feedback they get *should be*. If you are a buyer, you should be able to see what others have posted about a seller you are considering buying from. And sellers should have the same opportunity about persons who bid on their items. IMHO, that information does not in any way need to be connected to the items that a person won or sold - but that's just my feelings.

If Ebay separated the item listings from the feedback, kept the item listings private, and the feedback public, that would solve both privace and phishing issues.

Matt

sotoam
10-04-2006, 12:29 PM
If Ebay separated the item listings from the feedback, kept the item listings private, and the feedback public, that would solve both privace and phishing issues.

Matt



I don't know about doing this. Many times people have posted about shady auctions here because of the fact that someone purchased a carded figure with card damage, put a store sticker on the damage and put it up for sale tying to pass it off as a "beautiful" carded figure.

I still want to know what the items were that the person bought.

lego_rob
10-04-2006, 04:34 PM
I think the removal of private feedback for sellers is a step in the right direction, but as other have mentioned, I too would like to see the removal of the private auction format as well.

-Mike



Couldn't agree with you more, Mike. For a while it seemed as though eBay was set up to protect and encourage bogus sellers, and it is very refreshing to see them making a change in the right direction.

I for one report EVERY single custom/reproduction/recarded auction I see. They are a Trademark violation, and 99.999% of the time they are presented in a VERY misleading way.

Rob

MartijnEmmelot
10-04-2006, 05:15 PM
I for one report EVERY single custom/reproduction/recarded auction I see.
Rob



...that must be a days job seeing that eBay-UK has a whole recarded listing catagory http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/crazy.gif




They are a Trademark violation,



So we don't have to expect any limelighted bootleg collection of yours? http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

~Martijn!

Blitzkriegtrench
10-04-2006, 06:33 PM
I for one report EVERY single custom/reproduction/recarded auction I see. They are a Trademark violation, and 99.999% of the time they are presented in a VERY misleading way.

Rob


I fail to see how a custom/reproduced/recarded figure is a trademark violation-If that was the case anybody who restores anything (with non-original parts) is committing a copyright violation.
What about the guy who rebuilds a 1952 Ford F-150 (with a 454 Hemi) or the lady on Roadshow who replaced the parchment straps on the back of a chair (with leather ones) or the guy who mods a POTF II Millennium Flacon into a P.C.?
I really don't think custom/recarded/reproduced figure card can be a copyright violation-if that's the case tell Chip Foos and the boys @ G.A.S. and West Coast Customs and book rebinders etc. etc. etc. to pack thier bags fer da slammer http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif.
Spencer?:>}

AllanB
10-04-2006, 07:31 PM
About bloody time! http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I mean, what's the point of a feedback system that can be totally circumvented??

I hope sellers can easily block bidders with private feedback, I certainly would be.



what i don't understand, is someone who has perfect feedback, yet private. what's the point of that?


Well, the only reason I can think of it that they might have a really ugly neg that has been mutually withdrawn after a situation was worked out. Although the neg wont count on their %, & their feedback page will say "0 negs", the actual neg (&reply,follow-up,etc) will still show up on their feedback listings.

Regardless of how well sorted out the situation is, the seller may well have good reason to not want people to see why they had originally received the neg. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif



and they can still have private auctions... where the bidder is hidden. that's where the shady stuff happens, because no one can contact the bidders to tell them it's fake.


Yup, sure. But that doesn't worry me anywhere near as much as the fact that it also makes it *impossible* to spot shills, (or at least makes it impossible to be sure about them & report them) which sucks... http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Which I'm sure is something that eBay is *really* worried about... http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif I'm sure they *hate* sellers artificially pushing up finish prices.... http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

- Allan

lego_rob
10-05-2006, 12:40 AM
Ha-

I said the ones I see, not every one of them : )

There's nothing more annoying than seeing a auction for a carded 12 back Luke, POTF Han Trench, etc. and reading through a long, detailed description and then, at the very end, in small print it says "original figure has been recarded on a custom card" or "item is a reproduction made off of an original" or something of the sort. It's VERY misleading and it's all in the way the description is worded.

Pathetic! If you want the real thing, BUY the real thing.

Rob






So we don't have to expect any limelighted bootleg collection of yours? http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

~Martijn!



Never! Not in my collection. 1000% original in every respect http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Rob

Blitzkriegtrench
10-05-2006, 01:29 AM
Ha-

I said the ones I see, not every one of them : )

There's nothing more annoying than seeing a auction for a carded 12 back Luke, POTF Han Trench, etc. and reading through a long, detailed description and then, at the very end, in small print it says "original figure has been recarded on a custom card" or "item is a reproduction made off of an original" or something of the sort. It's VERY misleading and it's all in the way the description is worded.

Pathetic! If you want the real thing, BUY the real thing.


So, you wouldn't want an art print/litho of say something by Picasso/Renoir/Manet/Monet/Munch (it's a copy-just try to buy the original Mona Lisa http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif)?

Or a repro statue of say David or Atlas or The Statue of Liberty (ask New Jersey/New York if they want to sell http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif)?

You want whatever vintage cars you buy to have the original tires/upholstry/glass/engine/etc. etc. etc. ? http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

You only buy Levi Jeans ('cause he invented them ya know-the rest are just "copies" http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif)?

Or maybe you own no copies of any great old books-they're just "not the original"-See if you can buy the Gutenberg Bible http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smirk.gif.

Your dislike of recards/custom cards is just that-Your dislike, there are many others (some 'round here on da 'Scum) who recard thier figz, and who knows-maybe/possibly one day they may sell them (I am not saying anyone in particular-just an example).

In my humble opinion, these people are restoring a figure to what it looked like brand new, a common occurance (with other items-books/cars/furniture/houses)that has been going on since way long before you were born and will continue well after you pass.

People who can't plunk down $2K for a MOMC Vynil Caped Jawa settle for a custom-caped and carded version know what they are getting and are not harming you in the least.

And your "outing" of such auctions is reprehensible in the very least if an auction states somewhere in the description-no matter how minute-the type of carded specimen it is: custom carded/recarded/resealed/etc. etc. etc. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/mad.gif

And in the case of a false auction description-good for you http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif Keep up da good work-looking out fer your brotherman/sisterwoman, but leave the honest seller alone just because you dislike the aforementioned type of figures.
Spencer Dean Welch II?:>}

P.S.-Looking for a well done L-L Jawa with a custom rem. hood on a repro card-repro weapon O.K. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif.

P.P.S.-I now return you to your regularly scheduled "Bye Bye Private Feedback -- Yay Ebay! topic"

dlloyd
10-05-2006, 03:52 AM
And your "outing" of such auctions is reprehensible in the very least if an auction states somewhere in the description-no matter how minute-the type of carded specimen it is: custom carded/recarded/resealed/etc. etc. etc. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/mad.gif



If it's a recard it should say that clearly in the auction title. The only reason to hide it in small print is to mislead people that it is a genuine item.

I like vintage cars and have nothing against them being restored with new parts, but a restoration generally commands a lower price than an untouched, mint example. Structuring an auction listing to mislead that the car is mint is fundamentally dishonest.

Leif_G
10-05-2006, 06:01 AM
People who can't plunk down $2K for a MOMC Vynil Caped Jawa settle for a custom-caped and carded version know what they are getting and are not harming you in the least.




First of all, the above statement you made isn't always true. Many people have been sold recarded or custom pieces thinking they were buying an original piece. Also, I'll be the judge of what harms me thank you very much.

I know a thing or two about copyright violation. The fact of the matter is that printing anything off that say 'Star Wars' on it is an illegal copyright violation if you don't have a license with Lucasfilms to do so. End of story.

But this isn't just about copyright violation. Technically speaking you should also have written permission to even post an image of the Star Wars label (or any copyrighted material) on the Internet. No one here is a saint when it comes to copyright violations. This is more about using the law to take a swipe at what some see as a threat or annoyance.

If a custom or recard looks like an original piece and isn't an obvious attempt at 'fan art', then I say report it! To me, no VC Jawa is better than a pretend one.

That doesn't mean I don't appreciate a well made custom piece of fan art though. But in my books, if it isn't original, then it isn't art.

ClankTheRobot
10-05-2006, 09:33 AM
Baboom! It's blowin' up in dis piece!

Dakk says it best...to intentionally sell something, hoping to fool the general public into thinking it is real, should be a crime. The ONLY reason why someone would write a long, badly formatted description and stick one sentence in at the bottom saying its not really what you think it is, well...they're trying to commit fraud but leaving a truthful fingerprint to bail them out if they are caught.

And don't bring this up in the customizing forum or you might be called a Creep by someone who sells unlicensed fan art and recards on eBay.

Someone like that is a person you should avoid...they probably have a history of scalping modern figures as well. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Anyway, what was this thread about?

Greg

dlloyd
10-05-2006, 10:01 AM
Baboom! It's blowin' up in dis piece!

Dakk says it best...to intentionally sell something, hoping to fool the general public into thinking it is real, should be a crime.



It is in the UK. Is it not in the US?

Blitzkriegtrench
10-05-2006, 10:19 AM
If it's a recard it should say that clearly in the auction title.
---I Agree-SDW2

The only reason to hide it in small print is to mislead people that it is a genuine item.
---I also agree, but ideally a car seler would list his sale or leasing info in legible lettering in a Newspaper/TV advert and any company running a conest advert would have the rules legible as well-but they don't legally have to and EBAY sellers don't have to indicate a carded figure's status (recard/ reseal/repro) in the auction title, hence the old axiom "Caviat Emptor" (buyer beware).

I like vintage cars and have nothing against them being restored with new parts, but a restoration generally commands a lower price than an untouched, mint example.
---Again I agree (obviously), and a seller that lists them as such (expecting to get that price) is either a dishonest lying s.o.b. or a fool-but the buyer is a bigger fool for buying the car @ such an inflated price.

Structuring an auction listing to mislead that the car is mint is fundamentally dishonest.
---I strongly agree, but then that leads us to the conclusion that most companies are fundamentally dishonest and people are too (one does not divulge thier emotional baggage or enhanced/fake body parts) in thier name "Hi, I'm (thrice-divorced/caboose-uplifted/blonde-from-a-bottled/tan-in-a-bottled/green-eyed-contacted/formerly-known-as-Bob Rivers-woman) Roberta Rivers".
Bringing us full circle, back to CAVIAT EMPTOR.
SDW2?:>}

lego_rob
10-05-2006, 11:16 AM
Wha-???



Youíre completely missing the point. You canít compare one-of-a-kind pieces of artwork to mass produced toys. Youíre taking about two completely different things.




So, you wouldn't want an art print/litho of say something by Picasso/Renoir/Manet/Monet/Munch (it's a copy-just try to buy the original Mona Lisa http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif)?Or a repro statue of say David or Atlas or The Statue of Liberty (ask New Jersey/New York if they want to sell http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif)? You only buy Levi Jeans ('cause he invented them ya know-the rest are just "copies" http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif)?



I for one donít hang reproductions of any artwork in my house or office. I much rather enjoy traveling the world, visiting museums and experiencing the art in person and then savoring the images in my memory. Iíve been to at least 50 museums all through Europe, Scandinavia and the US and I have yet to see a reproduction that came even remotely close to capturing the color, detail, texture, emotion - the experience you get when viewing the original in person. Even if I did see one I thought was close, I wouldnít want it because itís not the original. Granted, there are several works I will never get to see because they are locked away in private collections, or werenít on display when I visited a particular museum (and yes, I am well aware that museums often display reproductions and keep the originals ďsafelyĒ locked away) but hey - that doesnít make me want to go buy a reproduction of it. Iíll just have to go back!




And your "outing" of such auctions is reprehensible in the very least if an auction states somewhere in the description-no matter how minute-the type of carded specimen it is: custom carded/recarded/resealed/etc. etc. etc. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/mad.gif



Clearly you have no comprehension of the term "Trademark" or the laws protecting them:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trademark

To create and sell anything with the Star Wars logo on it without having permission from Lucasfilm is illegal. So, regardless of oneís intentions, creating a reproduction backer card with a Star Wars logo and selling it is illegal and therefore SHOULD be called out. After all, it is ILLEGAL to sell copies or reproductions of Trade marked/licensed material on eBay (and honestly Ė and I know Iím not alone here Ė all it really does is pollute the hobby with fakes)




Your dislike of recards/custom cards is just that-Your dislike, there are many others (some 'round here on da 'Scum) who recard thier figz, and who knows-maybe/possibly one day they may sell them (I am not saying anyone in particular-just an example). In my humble opinion, these people are restoring a figure to what it looked like brand new, a common occurance (with other items-books/cars/furniture/houses)that has been going on since way long before you were born and will continue well after you pass.




Please donít lecture me on the subject of restoration. Iíve either restored or helped restore my fair share of everything from 60ís -70ís Mopars, Fords GMís and Porscheís to firearms and furniture, and I can assure you that restoring and preserving a car, truck or piece of furniture is very, very different than creating something using logos and images protected by law.

If I want a POTF Yak Face Iíll go buy one. If I want to see a VerMeer Iíll got the the Rijksmuseum.



You want whatever vintage cars you buy to have the original tires/upholstry/glass/engine/etc. etc. etc. ? http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/shocked.gif



Whenever possible, absolutely; I strive for purity and originality. When original parts have been replaced, I spend my time and money tracking down originals. If original parts canít be located, I use replacement parts produced by licensed aftermarket companies. Or I just fabricate the parts myself. AFAIK there arenít any laws that state you canít modify your car with original or aftermarket replacement parts, or even parts made by a completely different manufacturer. However, making a reproduction 12back Luke Skywalker action figure backer card, applying a figure and a bubble and selling it is illegal and technically Ė in my mind Ė constitutes fraud.




P.S.-Looking for a well done L-L Jawa with a custom rem. hood on a repro card-repro weapon O.K. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif.



Obviously we have two completely different opinions, and I respect yours. But in all honesty it IS technically illegal to create and sell reproductions of TMíd material, and thatís basically my point. If you're happy owning reproductions of carded Star Wars figures, that's great. I for one would rather have a hole in my collection than fill it with a fake, but to each his own.

Rob

Blitzkriegtrench
10-05-2006, 11:33 AM
People who can't plunk down $2K for a MOMC Vynil Caped Jawa settle for a custom-caped and carded version know what they are getting and are not harming you in the least.




First of all, the above statement you made isn't always true. Many people have been sold recarded or custom pieces thinking they were buying an original piece.
---I mis-wrote my thoughts, what I meant to say is "a person knowing they can not afford a $2K Jawa, settles for a recarded custom, the person who foolishly buys a recarded/custom fig falls under the old axiom "Caviat Emptor" (Buyer Beware)-SDW2

I know a thing or two about copyright violation. The fact of the matter is that printing anything off that say 'Star Wars' on it is an illegal copyright violation if you don't have a license with Lucasfilms to do so. End of story.
---So Andy Warhol was sued by Campbell's Soup or Jasper Johns sued by Ballentine-nope I don't think so, will I be sued for my custom carded custom figures nope. Yes there are alot of copyright violations going on everywhere, but Lucas's laywers (as well as other legal teams of copyright holders) pick and choose who to go after (I personally know someone who was visited by Lucas's legal team) or not to go after, because they would have to expend a great deal of finances to eliminate them all (maybe even what they take in).-SDW2

But this isn't just about copyright violation. Technically speaking you should also have written permission to even post an image of the Star Wars label (or any copyrighted material) on the Internet.
---Agreed, but any smart copyright owner knows any good idea exposure is good exposure and bad exposure is bad-so they go after those people.-SDW2

No one here is a saint when it comes to copyright violations. This is more about using the law to take a swipe at what some see as a threat or annoyance.
---Some people may see you as a threat or annoyance ('Scum custom recarders http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smirk.gif)-should they use the law to take a swipe @ you?-SDW2

If a custom or recard looks like an original piece and isn't an obvious attempt at 'fan art', then I say report it!
---If it is identified in the text (or even graphix) of an auction (no matter how miniscule), then I say butt out!-SDW2

To me, no VC Jawa is better than a pretend one.
---Obviously you meant to say "To me, not having a VC Jawa is better than having a pretend one.
Well good for you, but to some it is better to have a "pretend" VC Jawa than to not.-SDW2

That doesn't mean I don't appreciate a well made custom piece of fan art though. But in my books, if it isn't original, then it isn't art.
---Again to refrence my previous post-reply-You don't consider a litho print of say "The Scream" or the "Mona Lisa" or "Other World" or "The Absinthe Drinker" "art" then?
Well then I realy feel sorry for you.
Spencer?:>}

ClankTheRobot
10-05-2006, 11:46 AM
Baboom! It's blowin' up in dis piece!

Dakk says it best...to intentionally sell something, hoping to fool the general public into thinking it is real, should be a crime.



It is in the UK. Is it not in the US?



In theory it is, of course. For some reason though, everyone has a hard time enforcing it. For a country with so many lawyers and so much security, we sure have a hard time enforcing simple laws. I think everyone is just too busy...or lazy...or both...or it costs too much money. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

It's the obvious apathy toward these little laws that make habitual line-steppers work their way up to murder, IMO...ok, maybe not that extreme, but it lends to a good debate on where to draw the line.

phidias_barrios
10-05-2006, 12:15 PM
snip

I for one donít hang reproductions of any artwork in my house or office. I much rather enjoy traveling the world, visiting museums and experiencing the art in person and then savoring the images in my memory. Iíve been to at least 50 museums all through Europe, Scandinavia and the US and I have yet to see a reproduction that came even remotely close to capturing the color, detail, texture, emotion - the experience you get when viewing the original in person. Even if I did see one I thought was close, I wouldnít want it because itís not the original. Granted...

Rob



I hate repros as much as the next guy and I don't own any in my collection either.
Plus, you have valid points about trademark violations and the illegality of it all.

BUT..... and I say this with all due respect, you sir have a lot of money.
I think I have a pretty decent income too, but you've blown me out of the water whenever I've bid on something against you. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

That's my point.
Some of us are willing and able to pay $1000+ for a high end original piece.
But there are probably more collectors out there who simply don't have that kind of money.
Instead of knocking them for wanting a repro, maybe we should be a little more empathetic.

dlloyd
10-05-2006, 12:16 PM
-but they don't legally have to and EBAY sellers don't have to indicate a carded figure's status (recard/ reseal/repro) in the auction title, hence the old axiom "Caviat Emptor" (buyer beware).



Ebay's position on this is clear...



Be sure to follow eBay's rules regarding titles. The following types of titles are inappropriate for inclusion on eBay.

Titles that fail to state what the nature of the item is.
Titles that contain Web site addresses, email addresses or phone numbers. The only exception to this rule is the sale of domain names.
Titles that contain profane or obscene language.
Titles that use the following words in an attempt to market or advertise their item: "prohibited", "banned", "illegal", "outlawed" or any other descriptive word which may bring into question the legality of an item by either governmental or eBay standards.
Titles that include brand names other than the specific brand name used by the company that manufactured or produced the item you are listing. This is called keyword spamming and is not allowed on eBay. For additional information, read eBayís Keyword Spamming policy)

Leif_G
10-05-2006, 05:23 PM
So Andy Warhol was sued by Campbell's Soup or Jasper Johns sued by Ballentine-nope I don't think so, will I be sued for my custom carded custom figures nope. Yes there are alot of copyright violations going on everywhere, but Lucas's laywers (as well as other legal teams of copyright holders) pick and choose who to go after (I personally know someone who was visited by Lucas's legal team) or not to go after, because they would have to expend a great deal of finances to eliminate them all (maybe even what they take in).-SDW2




The fact that it's illegal to infringe copyright law does not depend on whether they choose to sue or not.






Obviously you meant to say "To me, not having a VC Jawa is better than having a pretend one.



No, what I meant to say was "To me, no VC Jawa, is better than a pretend one."





Again to refrence my previous post-reply-You don't consider a litho print of say "The Scream" or the "Mona Lisa" or "Other World" or "The Absinthe Drinker" "art" then?




Nope. It's a printed copy of art. And if it's not an illegal copy then it's produced under license. If you have a print depicting the Mona Lisa hanging on your wall, you have a picture of the painting, not the painting (work of art) itself.

JohnA
10-05-2006, 06:41 PM
---So Andy Warhol was sued by Campbell's Soup or Jasper Johns sued by Ballentine-nope I don't think so,



Artists are allowed to use a licensed logo or image as long as itís a one-of-a-kind piece of *original* art, if prints were made of it w/o the permission of the copyright owner then itís infringement. Besides, ultimately itís up to the license holder whether they choose to press charges or not.
ďHarley- Davidson, Warner Brothers, and Walt Disney sued tattoo parlors for using copyrighted logosĒ
http://www.yale.edu/tnj/content/feb06/bodiesofart.html



will I be sued for my custom carded custom figures nope.



So fast to think youíre safe are you? A member of this very board has a C/D letter from the LFL attorneys for sellingÖ [gasp] Kenner Commercials. Thatís right *just* commercials on VHS. Not only that they wanted stuff like lists of who he sold to and such. If you think LFL does not go after people you are sadly mistaken.



Yes there are alot of copyright violations going on everywhere, but Lucas's laywers (as well as other legal teams of copyright holders) pick and choose who to go after



Yeah, itís limited to who they catch. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif




(I personally know someone who was visited by Lucas's legal team) or not to go after, because they would have to expend a great deal of finances to eliminate them all (maybe even what they take in).



I havenít used this quote in a while:
ďYou wanna play the blind man, go walk with a Shepherd. But me, my eyes are wide ****in' open.Ē http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif



Again to refrence my previous post-reply-You don't consider a litho print of say "The Scream" or the "Mona Lisa" or "Other World" or "The Absinthe Drinker" "art" then? )
Well then I realy feel sorry for you.



Then I guess you feel sorry for me too. I was originally an art major in college and Iíve been an artist since childhood. I fully respect actual art but a print is a print, plain and simple. I consider a print no more a piece of artwork than I do a t-shirt with ďStarry NightĒ on it. Sure it's nice to look at but it's not quite the same. The price difference alone should have tipped you off. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif

John

JohnA
10-05-2006, 06:44 PM
If you have a print depicting the Mona Lisa hanging on your wall, you have a picture of the painting, not the painting (work of art) itself.



Maybe the next time he buys a 12 back or a POTF carded he wouldn't mind if somebody sent a picture of one instead. It's the same thing. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif

John

Leif_G
10-05-2006, 10:06 PM
If you have a print depicting the Mona Lisa hanging on your wall, you have a picture of the painting, not the painting (work of art) itself.



Maybe the next time he buys a 12 back or a POTF carded he wouldn't mind if somebody sent a picture of one instead. It's the same thing. http://threads.rebelscum.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif

John



LOL! I was thinking exactly the same thing! A 3D representation of the original work is no more a work of art itself than a 2D representation of the original, that is... a photo of the original.