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View Full Version : How DARE Lucas make Special Editions?!?



JediTricks
06-15-2001, 12:15 AM
Lucasfilm is upset over these Phantom Edit tapes out there, but I just thought of something that makes them not much more offensive than the Special Editions... Lucas didn't really create the Star Wars universe, he was like Dr. Frankenstein, taking pieces from different tales and slapping them together into this space fantasy. We'll call him the daddy of SW because he was the one who thought to put those pieces together in that order and was director of the first film and produced them all, but really, the idea that he, as the artist, has sole right to go back and make changes to "his art" simply because his efforts got the Star Wars ball rolling and he owns the rights is totally WRONG in my opinion. The original trilogy isn't a one-man show, Lucas didn't film himself in every costume and then process the shots into one scene with all those characters, the films were collaborative efforts on behalf of the other writers invovled, other directors, other editors, the producers, the actors, Ralph McQuarrie, set designers, prop makers, costumers, f/x designers, stuntmen, etc.. All these people helped make the art, and most are considered "artists" in their respective crafts, so why is George Lucas the only one considered THE artist? At one point, Gary Kurtz and George Lucas felt that the version of Star Wars they had at that time was so similar to Kurosawa's "The Hidden Fortress" that they were gonna have to buy the rights to it so they wouldn't get sued, so why didn't Gary Kurtz get a say in how the art that he worked so hard to nurture into something wonderful get changed for the Special Editions?

I think ultimately it's because Lucas really IS a control freak who feels that he is THE ARTIST and these producers, co-writers, f/x guys, set designers, actors, and even Ralph McQuarrie are merely the paints he used to make his art. But in reality (as opposed to Skywalker Ranch), this is merely megalomania and has less to do with the finished ART and more to do with Lucas' singular vision. Just because the Louvre owns the Mona Lisa doesn't mean they get to make her a blonde.

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"I am Vader, lord of the Sith! Behold my Patrick Duffy leg!"

BHC Moderator of POTF2, Galoob, Films, Ep 1, Lego, Classifieds
SSG Micro Machines and Lego Editor

[This message has been edited by JediTricks (edited 06-15-2001).]

06-15-2001, 06:58 AM
Well, I don't know who has been behind some of the decisions since the ROTJ, but with Jedi, the SE's and some scenes and characters in TPM, his genius is not looking too great. I don't know how much credit he wants to take for things like the much debated ewoks, gungans, Jar-Jar specifically, awkward comical moments, song and dance numbers, et al.....to me, if he did not have ANH and ESB to fall back on and much of the die hard fans hooked with those movies, he would have envisioned himself out of success.

Speaking for me personally, if ROTJ or TPM were the first 2 films in the saga to be released, I would not be collecting today....and I am being honest. I think the last two movies have been sorely lacking in parts and the credit I do give to them is more out of nostalgia, than for their own accord.

Right now, the series is batting .500 in my book if I look at it dispassionately in terms of my own childhood....If I frame it in terms of my childhood, which is full of figures and playing SW with Friends that Lucas had nothing to do with, I would give it .750.......maybe the creators should stop believing some of their own hype and get back to basics.

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Over?? Was it over when the Germans bombed Perl HarboR!!!?? Hell no! - Bluto Blutarski

PodRacer_X
06-15-2001, 07:41 AM
I don't think it has to do so much with megalomania in the literal sense of the term, but it is most artists' nature to never finish a work, so much as abandon it. Then the artist stews over it and sometimes goes back in and reworks it.

My favorite example of this was a particular painting of James McNeill Whistler was sold to a wealthy family, but the painting really bothered the artist, and one late night the family heard an intruder in their house. They peered into the room and saw the artist had broken into the house, taken the painting from the wall and was hunched over by candle light working on it!!

It's true that Lucas wasn't the only artist working on Star Wars, but he was in charge. All creative decisions were dependant on his final, authoritative, and inarguable word.

If anyone else had altered, edited, or reworked Star Wars claiming it to be the definitive version, I could not have accepted it. I don't agree with all the changes the man made, but as a creator I can't say he didn't have any right to make them. Had Ted Turner, for instance, tried to change it, I think his head would now be on a stick.

The good thing in the case of Star Wars is try as Lucas might to deny them, the original versions are preserved for posterity on a zillion video tapes and fan memories to compare the "new vision" by.

06-15-2001, 07:49 AM
I agree Podracer, as the creator, he has the right to change them, and as a fan, I have the right to say that many of the changes lately have been for the worse....IMHO.

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Over?? Was it over when the Germans bombed Perl HarboR!!!?? Hell no! - Bluto Blutarski

Sprry75
06-15-2001, 07:53 AM
I totally agree. There were no substantive additions made in the Special Editions that made those movies any better. One of the few changes that was really cool was the inclusion of the Luke/Biggs scene from Yavin, and that was original footage that had just been left out. But for the most part, the changes were just eye candy, which contributed virtually nothing to the movies. I've loved them for over twenty years, am I somehow supposed to love them more now that there's windows on Bespin? And that absolute crap new musical number from Jabba's palace is the worst part of the series. The problems with the special editions are symptoms of the greater illness affecting Lucas, which seems to me to be that the "vision," specifically the visual effects, has assumed a more important role than the "idea." It's the classic film conundrum of style over substance. Yeah, TPM and the SEs look great. But the characters of the OT are what made me a fan, not the special effects, and there is a complete dearth of character development in TPM. I didn't really care that much when either Qui Gon or Maul died, compared to how I felt when Ben, Yoda, and Anakin/Vader die in the OT.

So I'm all for stuff like the "Phantom Edit," for a couple of reasons. First, after having read several of the editorials put up on TheForce.net criticizing "The Phantom Editors," it seemed to me like they were trying to smooth over relations between themselves and Lucasfilm. I mean, let's face it, TheForce.net has had its share of copyright violations....

Also, I think it should be pointed out that according to the Zap2it.com article that talks about Lucasfilm's response to "The Phantom Edit," it is not the re-editing of The Phantom Menace that has Lucasfilm's lawyers chomping at the bit, it is the copying and distribution of the copyrighted material contained on the distributed discs. TheForce.net, however, wrote:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>“It's Day 4 of our daily RebelRouser features on the 2 fan-edited versions of "The Phantom Menace". We've had hundreds of emails this week in support of Lucas' vision for StarWars, and budding Phantom Editors might want to read the LucasFilm responsebefore they think about removing any more scenes.” <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It should be made clear that neither the Phantom Editors, or anyone else who takes a pair of scissors to their videotapes, have nothing to worry about when it comes to their alterations of the film, so long as they are only editing copies they have purchased. It is only when they begin to copy and distribute material that is copyrighted (even if they’ve cut things out or otherwise altered it, it is still copyrighted material) do they cross the line. I live in an incredibly conservative area (Provo, Utah), and there was quite a brouhaha a few years ago when a company began offering the "service" of editing the Kate Winslet nude scene out of Titanic for customers who brought in their tapes (of course, the dead babies floating in the water and passengers hitting their heads as they plummeted to their deaths were all left in, but that's another rant altogether). As was inevitable, lawyers got involved, and it turned out that there was nothing wrong with the editing of a video that someone had legally purchased.

Such is the case with Episode I. The Phantom Editors can chop up videotape however they want to and still be immune from any type of lawsuit. The only thing they can't do is start distributing that product without compensating the copyright owners. I think that is pretty clear from the Lucasfilm statement published on Zap2it, but it doesn't come across very clearly in any of the editorial positions, or in the language of the post quoted above.

As far as accusations of "artistic rape," well, they are entirely without merit. If I choose to fastforward through the unnecessarily long Tatooine sequences of the film, have I assaulted Lucas' vision? I don't think so. I have merely chosen to exercise my power as an audience to filter through that which I deem unworthy of my time. It may sound pretentious, but art is a communicative media, and if it doesn't hold the attention of the receiver of the message, it should not expect them to endure continual transmissions.

The fact of the matter is that Episode I disappointed a legion of Star Wars devotees. I love the original trilogy, and there were parts of Episode I I loved as well. But I admit, I was disappointed with a lot of the things that it sounds like the Phantom Editors were disappointed with. But that is my prerogative as a consumer. Simply because I wear the mantle of a Star Wars fan doesn't mean I have to swallow elements of the "universe" that I don't like. That's the reason I avoid so much of the Expanded Universe stuff. And, if George Lucas as an artist is satisfied with his work, then more power to him. But he'd better be prepared for criticism, as would be any other artist who displays his or her work to the public. But more importantly, if George Lucas as a businessman has any respect for me whatsoever as a consumer, then he needs to listen to my voice as well as the voices of the others who were not satisfied with his last product. If some of them chose to voice their discontent by making alterations to the film, then it should be understood as just that: an expression of discontent.

To accuse the Phantom Editors of artistic rape, or to accuse people like me of "not getting the vision" simply because we were really disappointed with the movie, is to deny the merits of our ideas and our ability to express them. And those seem to be the very principles the recent editorials on TheForce.net are trying to protect.

Now, I agree wholeheartedly that the distribution of copyrighted materials is against the law, and I have no problem with Lucasfilm protecting its interests (although I'd love a copy of the Phantom Edit). But I sincerely hope that George Lucas and the others involved with the franchise are a bit disturbed by this whole incident, and that it makes them think twice about the work of art/product they distribute. I'm not asking Lucas to compromise his vision to accommodate all of us weirdo fans--heaven forbid all artists try to cater their vision to what they think the audience wants, or we'll end up with even more Boy Bands and Britney Spears wannabes, not to mention more Jerry Bruckheimer movies. But I do expect artists to appreciate their audiences. If Lucas were making these movies for himself, to simply "express his vision," he'd just screen them privately at Skywalker Ranch. He sure wouldn't contract with Kentucky Fried Chicken to promote them. But Lucas, and all artists who have a vision that they expect consumers to pay to experience, needs to appreciate his intended audience. Artists who charge people to "share" in a vision need to understand that just because something has a label (or in this case, says "Star Wars" on it) the customer/audience doesn't have to like it.

I was dissatisfied with Episode I. Did I hate it? No. Did it cause me to lose my love for the Star Wars Universe? Of course not. But there were parts of the "vision" I could do without. And since I don't have access to editing machinery or "The Phantom Edit," I guess I'll just have to keep using my fastforward button. And I will fastforward confidently, knowing the Lucasfilm lawyers can't break down my door and strap me into the Clockwork Orange contraption, wire myeyelids open, and force me to "enjoy" the antics of Jar Jar Binks.

06-15-2001, 08:15 AM
The Titanic story is classic....simply classic. LOL



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Over?? Was it over when the Germans bombed Perl HarboR!!!?? Hell no! - Bluto Blutarski

Sprry75
06-15-2001, 08:59 AM
Hey, Maz, you think that's good? BYU hosted a Roudin exhibit, but they wouldn't display "The Kiss" because it was too "erotic." This place is a joke.

As a lawyer, I suppose you've read "One L" by Scott Turow, right? You know where he talks about going to law school to meet the enemy? Let's just say that I sure as hell have....

_DJ_
06-15-2001, 01:50 PM
Sprry75 is right. I also live in Utah, and indeed people were cutting scenes out of Titanic, as well as other films, to meet what they think is acceptable. The film industry tried to get involved but a consumer can do what ever they want with a purchase as long as they don't try and sell it. Well enough of that.

As for GL so called "VISION". I think, "the VISION" has been clouded over the years by HUGE dollar signs. Indeed back in the 70's I too became a fan because of the characters and the story. The effects were cool, but not the only reason I love SW. If it were, I would sit infront of my TV and watch Laser blasts, explosions, and computer generated garbadge all night long. ****NOT****

People go to a movie for the story first, effects second. Now if we can just get GL to see that agin. The next two episodes would be two of the greatest movies of all time.

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"I FIND YOUR LACK OF FAITH...DISTURBING"

steve_howard
06-15-2001, 02:43 PM
You all speak blasphemy. Do you remember "hook"? peter pan all grown up. These are movies that most all of us saw when we were "kids" Has everyone grown up so much that they can't just enjoy what lucas has given us? Regardless of how many people helped create the universe, Lucas came up with the story. Most all stories are unoriginal anymore, each idea has been hit on and changed around to seem new. I love all of it, ewoks, gungans, all of it. I am still a kid when I see these films. I will be crapped on by a bantha before I will complain about these films.

Philbirt
06-15-2001, 02:57 PM
The Great Darth Mazinga- I totally agree with you about the 4 movies so far. ROTJ is the weakest of the trilogy, and TPM doesn't deserve the Star Wars name in its title.
We all loved GL after the first 2 SW movies and Raiders. But what's with the Special ED movies? What's with the Gungans? and Jar Jar?!? Where did GL come up with this crap? WAY too much animation and not enough character development. And when they try to develope characters, it's so embaressing to watch, I rip out the video and put in ESB. Ep1 is a good movie- not great. I'm glad some people have the guts to admit it.
Phil

JediTricks
06-15-2001, 08:08 PM
Sprry, you are da MAN! I ask you to submit your lengthy comments, or at least a condensed version, to TFN as a counter-point to that "Artistic Rape" article they posted yesterday.

PRX, your statement <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>All creative decisions were dependant on his final, authoritative, and inarguable word.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>USED TO not be accurate back when Gary Kurtz and later Kurtz and Kershner were working on the SW films. Those two had disagreements with Lucas, they challenged his decisions, and some final words were Kurtz's, not Lucas'. Then, for ROTJ, Lucas brought in new co-producing teams and a director who would do whatever George said and only now does it seem like Lucas' word is the only authority. Lucas has even gone as far to change his company's history to lessen the impact of those he doesn't want to share credit with, like Tomlinson Holman's role in the creation of the THX audio standard.

Mazinga, Lucas didn't "create" much of ESB, yet he was able to cut and alter scenes because it's "his". That seems really wrong to me, he didn't direct the film, he wasn't even the only producer, writer, or editor, so why does he and he alone get to say how to change it now that it's out? Because it's his? That's not right IMO, that's not "the artist going back to the canvas after it's been on the wall" because he wasn't the only artist, he wasn't even the main artist.

Steve Howard, I think that whole school of thought that says "they're kids movies" as if only kids or those who narrow their scope to enjoy the film is a huge cop-out, as if adults COULDN'T have an imagination and enjoy a film for every reason it's good. A good film doesn't need to be limited to it's audience, only a bad one does. And Lucas pieced together the original SW story from other sources, he didn't create as much as LFL would like you to believe, mostly he wrote the sci-fi setting.

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"I am Vader, lord of the Sith! Behold my Patrick Duffy leg!"

BHC Moderator of POTF2, Galoob, Films, Ep 1, Lego, Classifieds
SSG Micro Machines and Lego Editor

[This message has been edited by JediTricks (edited 06-15-2001).]

Tooth_Kroth
06-15-2001, 10:31 PM
JediTricks, your train of thought runs smack into a brick wall.

It cannot be argued that children "see" things in a way adults do not. The case is not whether adults have the ability to imagine, but that kids imagine differently.

Saying that Mr. Lucas pieced together the SW story from other sources is saying nothing at all. That is human nature. The vast majority of what we think, say and do is based directly on our experiences. We all constantly borrow from our past experiences with people and things. A teacher borrows techniques from his/her former teacher or mentor. A fighter borrows moves from his/her coach. And a writter borrows ideas, style and inspiration from his/her role model and education.

If I invent a hot new sneaker, revolutionary or not, it is my creation. It doesn't matter whether I was inspired by Air Jordans or Reebok Pumps. As long as I don't infringe on any trademarks or patents, it remains my creation. I don't have to create an entirely new thing to be able to call it my idea.

Using the fact that Mr. Lucas drew upon multi-cultural mythological stories is a weak argument for him not being able to take the credit as the creator of SW. You can do better than that.



[This message has been edited by Twoth Kroth (edited 06-15-2001).]

steve_howard
06-16-2001, 03:12 PM
To straighten things a little: I did not say that it was a kids only film. Lucas created this for adults and children alike to enjoy. He also created something that he wanted to see when he was a "KID". I AM AN ADULT.
Some fans, mainly adults (18& older), have taken this way to far and are being way to politically correct.
What I meant to get across to you was that you should enjoy the film like a little kid and not question what is happening on the screen. Nor, complain because it does not fit in with your "Perfect Galaxy". It is a big galaxy. Anything is possible especially creatures like ewoks and gungans and wookies
and yodas. Or have you forgotten that it is sci fi.
And as far as I am concerned, Lucas has the rights to change any thing he wants. It has all looked good to me and millions of other people.
It really agrivates me that that people complain so much when they are given what they want and find ways to pick it apart.
If you aren't happy with what Lucas is doing then do not watch . Don't rock the boat just jump off.

JediTricks
06-17-2001, 06:38 AM
Twoth, if you invent your own running shoe that gets popular, then you've invented it. You've probably used design elements from other sources, but you invent it. Lucas didn't borrow from other sources in the literary sense where Luke's quest is reminiscent of Oddysius, we're talking about Lucas took pieces of Akira Kurosawa and other director's films, though mostly of Kurosawa's work according to Lucas interviews, and changing the settings to a sci-fi universe. It'd basically be like taking the opening sequence of Raiders of the Lost Ark and copy/replacing "Peru" into "the planet Tanntob". And as I pointed out, Lucas and Kurtz were so worried for a while that they WOULD be infringing upon Hidden Fortress that they were working on buying the rights.

Steve Howard, "It really agrivates me that that people complain so much when they are given what they want and find ways to pick it apart", did YOU want ANH to be changed so Greedo fired first, or ESB so that Luke screamed on his way down the center of Cloud City? I didn't, and that whole "don't rock the boat", I find this thing ridiculous. If fans didn't rock the boat, we'd still have SW figures on steroids carrying lightsabers taller than the actual figures.

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"I am Vader, lord of the Sith! Behold my Patrick Duffy leg!"

BHC Moderator of POTF2, Galoob, Films, Ep 1, Lego, Classifieds
SSG Micro Machines and Lego Editor

Daigo_Bah
06-17-2001, 09:14 AM
Both sides of the argument are debated so well, that it's hard to find the most correct view. Of course, since this is based on opinion, each person can see it as they like.
One thing I'm not sure about is the similarity to past movies. The Art of Star Wars as well as the various storyboard and production paintings show vast differences from the initial idea of ANH, and what it turned out to be. This is corroborated with the annotated screenplays as well. Fact of the matter is , Lucas changed many aspects of his first (perhaps "borrowed") story, to make what turned out to be the film loved by millions that Kurosawa films never were. I also believe that it is what Hamill, Fisher, Ford, and Daniels among others brought to the story, not just the script.

06-18-2001, 05:57 AM
"I will be crapped on by a bantha before I will complain about these films."


Good to see we are being objective about these things........Steve, you were crapped on, it was called Jar-Jar Binks and Ewoks....you can be a fan of the films without being a fanatic...it is ok to not like everything.


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Over?? Was it over when the Germans bombed Perl HarboR!!!?? Hell no! - Bluto Blutarski

JediTricks
06-18-2001, 07:38 PM
Daigo-bah, you are of course correct, and Lucas went through probably 6 different versions of the screenplay before settling on what we see on screen, but your last point really brings home what bugs me about Lucas' attitude towards his changing of the SEs. I also think that the artists involved in Star Wars, from the actors to the set designers, were what gave it that special something, and if those artists have contributed something substantial which breathed magic and life into this film, then I think the film is diminished by only one of these artists making changes to a canvas they all put their art upon. I guess I feel like once great art is released into the public and absorbed and accepted by it's audience, those who directly created the art should bee the only ones to have a say in how the art should be treated. If I commission a statue to be made of a hawk, while it is mine, I think it'd be wrong to then break its talon off and glue it onto an eyeball, I commissioned the art from artists because I myself am not capable of doing it all myself.

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"I am Vader, lord of the Sith! Behold my Patrick Duffy leg!"

BHC Moderator of POTF2, Galoob, Films, Ep 1, Lego, Classifieds
SSG Micro Machines and Lego Editor

Sprry75
06-18-2001, 08:42 PM
And how would you feel if you were the guy who had to spend hours in that hot, hairy Lak Sivrak suit, and then all of a sudden *BAM* you're no longer a part of the greatest movie of all time?

Daigo_Bah
06-19-2001, 07:03 AM
I totally see what you mean about this, JT- that Lucas claims the entire 9-episodes (now only 6) have been in his head since the early seventies. So why did Chewbacca originally look like a lizard? Luke was Han, Cloud City was an Imperial prison from ANH, Vader had a castle, and various other ideas that almost were. And don't tell me he waited until the late nineties to be able to create Jar Jar properly! I also agree that the first 3 films (heck, Ep1 as well) were a result of collaboration with dozens and dozens of minds (think about that C-3PO's voice was never intended to be an English prissy accent, etc) and that for Lucas to change them is a bit disrespectful. But, the people involved themselves have stated in interviews, "it's his baby- he can change what he wants". I do agree with you that you don't colorize a black and white movie- the Special Editions should probably not have happened.

06-19-2001, 06:15 PM
I certainly appreciate the need to resist censorship, but I also know there's a whole slew of films I'd love for my kids to see but I can't let them because of the content. Subtract the nudity and some language in Titanic, and I'd have no trouble with my kids watching it. I'm dying for my son to see Blazing Saddles, but not until he's at least 13, and there's STILL stuff I'd have to explain.

"I know they said '*****.' But saying that is WRONG. That's the whole point." Catch my drift?

Sprry75
06-19-2001, 07:02 PM
Darth Sebulba, I don't know if you read my post above, but I happen to know a place that can make your copy of Titanic "kid-friendly." http://www.collectstarwars.com/ubb/images/icons/wink.gif

Tooth_Kroth
06-19-2001, 07:51 PM
I have done paintings and drawings for people and have been paid for my work. I entered each agreement knowing full well that from the very beginning until the time I was paid, that the art belonged to my customer, not myself. Yes, I did the work. Yes, it was completely born of my hand, but I did not choose the subject matter. Furthermore, during the creative process, my work would often be changed and/or modified by my customers. That is expected when you're working for someone. Whether it's creating a work of art or flippin' burgers, the employee agrees to do what the boss requires.

It's not like Jonh Williams, Ben Burt and Harrison Ford played thier parts in making SW just for the artistic pleasure of it all. They did it because they were getting paid.

How do you think Ralph McQuarrie and Doug Chiang felt about spending days and weeks imagining and drawing ships, creatures and settings just to have Mr. Lucas drop the hatchet on them? At the moment, probably a little sad, but ask them how they felt on Friday when they were cashing that fat ***** check!

All the folks that contributed to the SW films were just doing thier jobs. Even so, there is no lack of mention given to those who did contribute to SW. There is not one SW film guide or book that does not give these fine people the respect they deserve.

I work for a living. I get paid for my work. A fair day's wage for a fair day's work. That's how I like it. I would never presume to lay personal claim to the product of which I contributed my efforts to make. That is the case with the folks who were paid, by Mr. Lucas, to make the SW films.

BTW, JediTricks, It was quite chivalrous of you to not begin a flame war. My previous post could have been misconstrued as hostile. MTFBWY.



[This message has been edited by Twoth Kroth (edited 06-19-2001).]

JediTricks
06-20-2001, 09:49 PM
I try not to flame anybody, even if the moment gets to me. I have failed in the past and will probably fail in the future, but I still try.

I still think that a measure of artistic integrity should be afforded to every artist who put a substantial amount of work into Star Wars, but even if you don't and you feel like they're just working, that doesn't jive for Gary Kurtz, who had as much control over the first 2 films as Lucas, or Kershner, who directed ESB, or Lawrence Kasdan who wrote the bulk of ESB. Yes, they did get paid by LFL, but they were in charge of elements that Lucas gave control away to.

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"I am Vader, lord of the Sith! Behold my Patrick Duffy leg!"

BHC Moderator of POTF2, Galoob, Films, Ep 1, Lego, Classifieds
SSG Micro Machines and Lego Editor

Tooth_Kroth
06-22-2001, 03:09 PM
There is no question that authority was delegated, no matter to what extenet. Mr. Lucas, however, always remaind the boss.

PodRacer_X
06-25-2001, 07:32 AM
I can validate JT's argument. I have worked extensively designing and building sets in theatre, which is a very collaborative process. Peoples' opinions ARE going to differ when so many artistic visions (and the egos attached to them) are on the line. The bitterest argument I've ever been in was on the design of a set for which I had a very definite and particular vision, but the director completely disagreed. He was the boss, so he won. The show progressed, opened, then closed and we all went on to other projects. I never agreed with the director, and to this day I resent having to compromise my vision. I've already played out the "what if" scenerio, and of course, I think the show would have been miles better had I been free to pursue my ideas. But that's not the nature of the beast. I was the designer, better suited for the job than the director, but he was in charge of the entire production, and in all fairness, he had to consider many more thaings than I. With so many people working on something, someone has to have ultimate discression and authority. In film, it SHOULD be the director, as it was in my case with the theatre, but in Hollywood, it's USUALLY the producer or studio, or whoever is in charge of the cash. That's Lucas.

Sith_Lord_Cosmo
07-03-2001, 07:18 AM
First off, I love the Special Editions. I think they were the greatest thing to happen to Star Wars. Now, before you start hitting "post reply" as fast as you can to flame me, read the whole thing

I'm guessing that most of you who dislike the special editions were born around 1970 or so. So you were able to see the Original Triology in the theaters, and remember it.

I was born in 1980. I was 3 months old when Empire came out and I was only 3 years old when Jedi hit. I never got to see the OT in the theaters

Then the Special Editions hit. This was what I had been waiting for, Star Wars on the big screen. I remember how exited I was hearing the 20th Century Fox Fanfare, and seeing the big yellow Star Wars logo for the first time. I was blown away watching dogfight at the end of A New Hope. I thought, "This is how Star Wars is meant to be watched."

So, while all you old timers can ramble on about Ewoks and end celebrations, and how George Lucas has personally violated you by making them. I can sit back and think about how lucky I was to get a snow day, so I could be the very first person in line to see Empire

The special editions gave people of my generation and younger, who would otherwise not get to see Star Wars on a big screen, the chance to experience the OT as it was meant to be

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"Jabba, you're a wonderful human being."
-Han Solo
http://crackhouse.8k.com

07-03-2001, 07:38 AM
Remember Cosmo.....if it was not for the rabid support of us "Old Timers" and our rambling to theaters and toy stores, you would have never seen a special edition.

If you were not born till 80 then you could not spend money and time on the first round....we took up the slack and our support made Lucas successful enough to attempt a re-issue. You do not see a special edition invisioning of "Dude Who Stole My Car", do you?

The force may be with you young one, but you are not a Jedi yet....


In the end success and power is dervied from the support and consent of the people and as a supporter, I will have my say on Ewoks et al........I am paraphrasing Thomas Hobbs, but if we would not support SW, there would be no SW.

Therefore, we are right to our opinions on the subject.

Great writing kid, don't get cocky.

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Over?? Was it over when the Germans bombed Perl HarboR!!!?? Hell no! - Bluto Blutarski


[This message has been edited by The Great Darth Mazinga (edited 07-03-2001).]

Sith_Lord_Cosmo
07-03-2001, 09:17 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Great Darth Mazinga:

a special edition invisioning of "Dude Who Stole My Car"

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you ever mention this again, I will see to it that you get banned http://www.collectstarwars.com/ubb/images/icons/wink.gif

07-03-2001, 09:21 AM
Over emphasis to make the point......

What will it be like when we land on the asteriod?


Scariest environment imaginable, that's all you had to say, scariest environment imaginable.